stage1+ vs stage 2

[cossielee]

how do these compare on an edition30 , unsure on what to buy next , downpipe/intercooler or hpfp
don't really want to be putting a clutch in the car after only owning here 2 months lol
plus am not after owtright power as such that's what the cossie is for
cheers

[AJP]

I'd always recommend a pump first. Certainly before the intercooler anyway - I wouldn't worry about that until you're wanting 2+ (or live in Dubai).

Problem with Stage 2 (ie downpipe with standard pump) is your fuelling requests are right at the limits of a standard pump. Fuel cuts are common. And power delivery is a bit flat without being able to get more fuel in.

If you've got the budget for a downpipe and aftermarket intercooler, you shouldn't be far off the budget for a downpipe and uprated pump instead. Which is a much better solution if you're not chasing numbers and want something reliable with much better low-mid torque than any setup with a standard pump could provide.

You will be slipping your clutch soon after going past 330-340lb/ft though. That's something you've just got to commit to and uprate the clutch. Otherwise, stick with a Stage 1 map. Plenty of power with your k04.

[cossielee]

 cheers bud , few points to think about , I do like a good punch of mid range power tho lol , or I might just leave it till I can go stage 2+

[flashp]

I'd always recommend a pump first. Certainly before the intercooler anyway - I wouldn't worry about that until you're wanting 2+ (or live in Dubai).

Problem with Stage 2 (ie downpipe with standard pump) is your fuelling requests are right at the limits of a standard pump. Fuel cuts are common. And power delivery is a bit flat without being able to get more fuel in.

If you've got the budget for a downpipe and aftermarket intercooler, you shouldn't be far off the budget for a downpipe and uprated pump instead. Which is a much better solution if you're not chasing numbers and want something reliable with much better low-mid torque than any setup with a standard pump could provide.

You will be slipping your clutch soon after going past 330-340lb/ft though. That's something you've just got to commit to and uprate the clutch. Otherwise, stick with a Stage 1 map. Plenty of power with your k04.

This!
Maintaing a good AFR (air fuel ratio) will protect your engine and help you get the best from ANY map. Some OE pumps are fine with it some are not. Loba are priced well at the moment.

[Lewo]

Was thinking along the same line as you.
The link might help, it clarified things for me.
http://r-techperformance.co.uk/2-0-tfsi-tuning/

[cossielee]

thanks lads, its got me thinking now lol , but surely the more torque will kill the clutch quicker ??

[AJP]

thanks lads, its got me thinking now lol , but surely the more torque will kill the clutch quicker ??

Yeah, it will. Mine started slipping when I had a full BCS fitted on Stage 1 R-Tech (k03). This was only at around 320lb/ft peak at the time.

It's not a solid rule for every car though - there are quite a few tuned ed30s on here on standard clutches. So you might be alright. But there's just as much chance it'll kill the clutch. I bit the bullet and went for a Helix Organic clutch with new OEM flywheel. Good for 400lb/ft. It stung a bit, as I wasn't expecting the outlay, but now I'm in a good position to run some decent boost.

Put it this way, if you're wanting to go past 300lb/ft or so, ie past Stage 1, it would be wise to have the funds backing you up just in case the clutch goes. I wouldn't say you'd be unlucky if it did, more that it's highly likely.

The DSG boys don't have this problem, up to 400 odd lb/ft anyway. But then their uprated clutch packs get really expensive!

You said before that your Cossie is the real toy, so I'd personally be inclined to chase power with that. Plus, there's only so much power you can actually get to the road in a mk5 GTI. Mine will spin up in 3rd if it's too cold or even slightly damp on the roads. Which is half the bloody year in this country. Although it's damn good fun when it does hook up and you can get 350lb/ft down!

[cossielee]

thanks lads, its got me thinking now lol , but surely the more torque will kill the clutch quicker ??

Yeah, it will. Mine started slipping when I had a full BCS fitted on Stage 1 R-Tech (k03). This was only at around 320lb/ft peak at the time.

It's not a solid rule for every car though - there are quite a few tuned ed30s on here on standard clutches. So you might be alright. But there's just as much chance it'll kill the clutch. I bit the bullet and went for a Helix Organic clutch with new OEM flywheel. Good for 400lb/ft. It stung a bit, as I wasn't expecting the outlay, but now I'm in a good position to run some decent boost.

Put it this way, if you're wanting to go past 300lb/ft or so, ie past Stage 1, it would be wise to have the funds backing you up just in case the clutch goes. I wouldn't say you'd be unlucky if it did, more that it's highly likely.

The DSG boys don't have this problem, up to 400 odd lb/ft anyway. But then their uprated clutch packs get really expensive!

You said before that your Cossie is the real toy, so I'd personally be inclined to chase power with that. Plus, there's only so much power you can actually get to the road in a mk5 GTI. Mine will spin up in 3rd if it's too cold or even slightly damp on the roads. Which is half the bloody year in this country. Although it's damn good fun when it does hook up and you can get 350lb/ft down!

yeah am hoping to get the cossie to over 500bhp this year or early next , but also want a bit more from the ed30 , I do think its mapped already as 3rd and 4th in damp will light the wheels up ,but like you say if I went stage 2 or 2+ and then needed a clutch its best part of 1200 quid or so which is a nice ported head on the cossie lol

[Level 7 boss]

thanks lads, its got me thinking now lol , but surely the more torque will kill the clutch quicker ??

Yeah, it will. Mine started slipping when I had a full BCS fitted on Stage 1 R-Tech (k03). This was only at around 320lb/ft peak at the time.

It's not a solid rule for every car though - there are quite a few tuned ed30s on here on standard clutches. So you might be alright. But there's just as much chance it'll kill the clutch. I bit the bullet and went for a Helix Organic clutch with new OEM flywheel. Good for 400lb/ft. It stung a bit, as I wasn't expecting the outlay, but now I'm in a good position to run some decent boost.

Put it this way, if you're wanting to go past 300lb/ft or so, ie past Stage 1, it would be wise to have the funds backing you up just in case the clutch goes. I wouldn't say you'd be unlucky if it did, more that it's highly likely.

The DSG boys don't have this problem, up to 400 odd lb/ft anyway. But then their uprated clutch packs get really expensive!

You said before that your Cossie is the real toy, so I'd personally be inclined to chase power with that. Plus, there's only so much power you can actually get to the road in a mk5 GTI. Mine will spin up in 3rd if it's too cold or even slightly damp on the roads. Which is half the bloody year in this country. Although it's damn good fun when it does hook up and you can get 350lb/ft down!

yeah am hoping to get the cossie to over 500bhp this year or early next , but also want a bit more from the ed30 , I do think its mapped already as 3rd and 4th in damp will light the wheels up ,but like you say if I went stage 2 or 2+ and then needed a clutch its best part of 1200 quid or so which is a nice ported head on the cossie lol

Didn't think an uprated clutch and flywheel were that expensive. Think you'll be looking at around £600.

https://www.awesomegti.com/shop-by-car/volkswagen/golf-mk5/sachs-performance-clutch-kit-for-golf-mk5-gti-and-edition-30/