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Author Topic: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?  (Read 9247 times)

Offline pudding

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #30 on: October 06, 2017, 09:02:31 pm »
Was it an EP3?  They liked chewing through electric steering racks and 2nd/3rd gear syncros.

Yes was an EP3 but to be honest I don't think previous owners had looked after it too well. Suspension need completely refreshing as the shocks were shot, multiple bushes had gone and went, chewed through a set of front drop links, air con pump tried to escape on the motorway one day, constant knocking/grinding from the front I could not trace, drunk oil and I mean drunk oil, engine mounts, I'm sure there is more but I can't remember now. If you had it in the right gear at the right time it went ok but normal everyday driving it was pretty slow to be honest. Ohh and the thing rattled everywhere.

I have a friend that swears by Japanese car but my experience has always been the interior feel cheap.

I had an EP3 not long after they first came to the UK for about 6 months.  It had a persistent pull to the left.  2 racks and alignments later, still did it.  Not even Honda knew what was up with it.  The gearbox wasn't too happy either, as mentioned above.  Maybe it was an early car with teething troubles but I couldn't live with that pull to the left and got rid of it.  Otherwise it was a good car, if a bit droney in the cabin and crashy over bumps.  The FN2 drove a bit better day-to-day imo, in spite of the fixed rear beam axle, but it was boring and even harsher.....and let's not forget the 1hp power increase  :grin:


2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140 | 2016 BMW 330D

Offline Chris92

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #31 on: October 06, 2017, 09:21:42 pm »

Also bear in mind car makers deliberately don't make their products last forever, in the same way Apple don't want you to have an iPhone 4 forever.

Exactly! I remember when I said a similar thing to this on this forum a year or two ago and had people gunning me down from all angles telling me how stupid I was.

Offline Molesy

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #32 on: October 06, 2017, 11:18:06 pm »
https://www.s2ki.com/forums/uk-ireland-s2000-community-25/joshs-s2k-build-thread-1170995/

Not sure if that will work ... but a few pics there   :happy2:


Sorry folks , going off topic  :ashamed:

Nice motor BodyBorder, S2K has always been on my list but nowadays i need a Golf size car, but if I ever buy a house with a garage and driveway it would be a hard choice between the GTI and S2K for the garage spot!

AJP hit the nail on head with this, alot have been modded but not maintained. For me maintenance comes first, generally as bits need replacing they get upgraded, good fuel and regular good quality oil changes often get overlooked but are very important esp on a performance car, imo its the little details that matter.

However sometimes you're unlucky and get a dog, it was a dog before you got it and will be a dog until it goes to the scrapyard in the sky, some cars are built that way, its just some makes you get it more often than others.

Molesy  :happy2:
« Last Edit: October 06, 2017, 11:20:08 pm by Molesy »

Offline barelyrelevant

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #33 on: October 06, 2017, 11:42:03 pm »
DSG faults are not unique to the GTI - Take the Evo X for example, which has a comical design flaw that prevents you from selecting any gears.  Box has to be stripped down to glue a sensor positioning magnet back on!  Doesn't happen on VWs.

Chain wear - It's a chain.  They wear out.  Again, not unique to VW.  They don't last forever on bikes either.

Rust is not unique to the GTI - It's steel and wants to return to it's natural iron oxide state.  No escaping that.  No steel body shell lasts forever.  It affects all cars, even Japanese ones.  If you live by the sea in a cold climate, you're on borrowed time.  If you live in Florida, not so much of a problem.

Failed PCV / DVs - Again, other cars use the same design and plastic and rubber is certainly not going to last forever.  GFB DV+ is a simple solution for that.

Cam follower - A bit of an internet folklore problem and not an issue on standard cars with a good oil changed in a timely fashion.

Wheel bearings - Ditto the chain.  It's a wear item and not a design flaw.

Thermostat failure - Again, not a unique problem to the GTI.  At least with this car it seizes open.  Try an E39 BMW with it's electrically controlled thermostat that jams shut, plus the part is 5x the cost of the GTI part.

Charcoal canister - Really?  A plastic box has been listed as a flaw/problem?? 

Saying that other marques have worse DSG issues is not very reassuring lol.

The chain *should* be a life time of the engine item, if not it should be in the service schedule, and isn't it normally the tensioner which fails, meaning the chain can slap around, rather then the chain itself stretching?

Rust - i'm sorry but VW messed up on this, I know all cars rust, but very few modern cars seem to be going as badly as the mk5. What are the known areas - wings, cills, rear arches, boot, that's basically every panel lol? I see 20 year old Peugeot 306s with less rust than that, if a cheap French hatchback can last that long then IMO it's a poor show that a premium brand (with the price tag to match) cannot do it.

DV/PCV failures - yes fair enough not a difficult or expensive fix, but still another maintenance item.

Cam follower I think is a poor design - should at least be on a visual inspection as part of the service.

Rear wheel bearings are wear and tear, but the GTI does seem to go through them more than other cars, whether that's due to the geometry/axle design?

Thermostats are a common point of failure across many cars, but again it just seems like between the main and inline ones, many owners have had to replace them.

I thought there was an issue with the charcoal canister where a valve failed and then if you brimmed the tank it ruined the canister and had to be replaced - could just be inaccurate info I read online though?

I understand quite a few of the issues would technically come under wear and tear, but then there aren't many parts on a car you could argue are not wear and tear. This is probably just me, but I consider standard wear and tear parts to be brakes/tyres/suspension/bushes/clutches/cambelts, things like that, once you start getting much beyond that you start to wonder if it could have been engineered better.

I suppose at the end of the day much of the complexity required in modern engines comes from the demands of emissions/power/economy.

Interesting thread so far!

Offline GTi-Tecnix

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #34 on: October 09, 2017, 02:15:28 am »
The MK5 was a revolutionary machine that has now set a precedent for the Mk6, Mk7 models to follow. Aside from the problems you mention this is a tough machine, performs amazingly well and hands the road and corners imensely. It won several awards two years running. It is the most revolutionary car of its generation of all its predecessors.  Hands down dude. You betcha!  :congrats:




Having owned one for a while and reading about/experiencing some of the many faults I am wondering if they are actually any good or not. I know all cars have their issues but the mk5 seems to have more than any car I have experienced before.

Obviously opinion on here is going to be biased, but I thought it was an interesting topic for discussion.

Common issues:
- Rust pretty much everywhere
- Failing DV, PCV
- Cam follower wear (huge bill if not changed)
- Rust/seizing bonnet catch release
- Cam chain/tensioner failure
- Oil pick up blockages/low oil pressure warning light
- A/C compressor failure
- Coked up intake valves
- Thermostat(s) failure
- Mechatronic issues on DSG
- Rear wheel bearings
- Whiteworm on Monza wheels
- ABS sender
- Tumble flaps?
- Door lock module
- Charcoal canister

Not sure if I've missed anything?

*zips up flame suit*
[/quote]
« Last Edit: October 11, 2017, 05:22:32 pm by GTi-Tecnix »
Rapid Acceleration on a Slippery surface
Sounds like a MK5 GTI 💥👊🏽💯

Offline stealthwolf

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #35 on: October 09, 2017, 10:36:09 am »
I've had my ED30 for almost 10 years and covered 100K miles. So here's my faults according to your list.

- Rust pretty much everywhere
Nope. I've had a bit over the left wing which only started at year 8 and was done under warranty. Nil elsewhere.

- Failing DV, PCV
PCV has been fine. I replaced DV from C to D because there was an issue. I switch to G as prophylaxis.

- Cam follower wear (huge bill if not changed)
Car was on T&D servicing using LL3 oil for first four years. At around 40K, Alex at AKS did an inspection - it was worn.
Car was then on 10W40 Millers performance oil, six monthly oil changes. Cam inspected at I think 90K. Looked mint.

- Rust/seizing bonnet catch release
No problems so far but I've periodically greased it.

- Cam chain/tensioner failure
*fingers crossed* no issues so far

- Oil pick up blockages/low oil pressure warning light
*fingers crossed* no issues so far

- A/C compressor failure
Nope.

- Coked up intake valves
Had the inlet valves cleaned at around 90K. Chris at AKS said they weren't in too bad condition.

- Thermostat(s) failure
Nope.

- Mechatronic issues on DSG
Manual so doesn't apply.

- Rear wheel bearings
I think I had these replaced around 70 or 80K.

- Whiteworm on Monza wheels
I bought my Monzas off Greeners who used A1 wheels to refurbish them. They use a different lacquer and it's been fine. I've seen non-VAG cars with whiteworming on diamond cut wheels.

- ABS sender
No, though I did have an ABS sensor go at around 30K, replaced under warranty.

- Tumble flaps?
Nope.

- Door lock module

Two had problems and two replaced as a precaution. This was around 60-70K.

- Charcoal canister
Nope.

The GTI isn't just a machine. It's very much a living, breathing thing.

Offline pudding

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Re: Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?
« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2017, 03:14:18 pm »

Saying that other marques have worse DSG issues is not very reassuring lol.

The chain *should* be a life time of the engine item, if not it should be in the service schedule, and isn't it normally the tensioner which fails, meaning the chain can slap around, rather then the chain itself stretching?

Rust - i'm sorry but VW messed up on this, I know all cars rust, but very few modern cars seem to be going as badly as the mk5. What are the known areas - wings, cills, rear arches, boot, that's basically every panel lol? I see 20 year old Peugeot 306s with less rust than that, if a cheap French hatchback can last that long then IMO it's a poor show that a premium brand (with the price tag to match) cannot do it.

DV/PCV failures - yes fair enough not a difficult or expensive fix, but still another maintenance item.

Cam follower I think is a poor design - should at least be on a visual inspection as part of the service.

Rear wheel bearings are wear and tear, but the GTI does seem to go through them more than other cars, whether that's due to the geometry/axle design?

Thermostats are a common point of failure across many cars, but again it just seems like between the main and inline ones, many owners have had to replace them.

I thought there was an issue with the charcoal canister where a valve failed and then if you brimmed the tank it ruined the canister and had to be replaced - could just be inaccurate info I read online though?

I understand quite a few of the issues would technically come under wear and tear, but then there aren't many parts on a car you could argue are not wear and tear. This is probably just me, but I consider standard wear and tear parts to be brakes/tyres/suspension/bushes/clutches/cambelts, things like that, once you start getting much beyond that you start to wonder if it could have been engineered better.

I suppose at the end of the day much of the complexity required in modern engines comes from the demands of emissions/power/economy.

Interesting thread so far!

Yeah, check out MRT performance on YouTube.  The Mitsubishi DSG issue is well covered on there.  A sensor position magnet 'falls off' (because it's glued on) and then the DSG ECU has no idea what gear it's in.  It really is quite amusing for 'Japanese reliability'.  It should have been clipped or bolted on.

No the chain wears out allowing the tensioner to run out of travel.  It happens to everything that uses a chain.  Bikes, motorbikes, chainsaws, car engines. 
I agree if it needs changing, it should be noted on the service schedule......but everyone knows car makers play the game to get your business.  They try their damnedest to not mention expensive maintenance.  Think yourself lucky you don't have an early R32!!! 

I've had 1 wing replaced in it's 10 year, 115K life so far.  The rest of the car is corrosion free.  You make it sound like every MK5 on the road is a rotting pig.  I would say that any MK5 that has rot on every panel is either a rare 2004 Friday afternoon job with a billion miles on it, and lives by the sea, or has been smacked and badly repaired.  More likely the latter.

Agreed on the Cam follower.  Not the best design as it's not as robust against neglect, hence why VW switched to a roller follower on the MK6/MK7 engine, which can handle more abuse.

Again, only done 1 bearing in 10 years / 115K miles, so I doubt it's an issue with the chassis design.   It's hard to say without any context.  Who's to say the wheel hasn't been whacked onto a kerb?  Or someone is using 25mm spacers and slammed on air ride? 

Thermostats......well, it's a cheap plastic part easy enough to replace.  More frequent changes of G13 might help as it has rust inhibitors and lubricants in it.

No the carbon inside the canister just gets saturated and loses it's ability to absorb Hydrocarbons.  Again, I've replaced one in 10 years.  That's about 60p a month over 10 years.

No offense, but I think you are a little ignorant about mechanical engineering, materials and their properties and the marketing strategies of car makers.  I also get the feeling you have an axe to grind with VW, or you've lost the love and trying to support that feeling by running the car down......either way, you won't be convinced.  But good luck with your next car.  I guarantee it will be worse than the MK5 for faults if you get a post 2010 car  :smiley:







2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140 | 2016 BMW 330D