Is the Mk5 GTI actually pretty rubbish?

[barelyrelevant]

Having owned one for a while and reading about/experiencing some of the many faults I am wondering if they are actually any good or not. I know all cars have their issues but the mk5 seems to have more than any car I have experienced before.

Obviously opinion on here is going to be biased, but I thought it was an interesting topic for discussion.

Common issues:
- Rust pretty much everywhere
- Failing DV, PCV
- Cam follower wear (huge bill if not changed)
- Rust/seizing bonnet catch release
- Cam chain/tensioner failure
- Oil pick up blockages/low oil pressure warning light
- A/C compressor failure
- Coked up intake valves
- Thermostat(s) failure
- Mechatronic issues on DSG
- Rear wheel bearings
- Whiteworm on Monza wheels
- ABS sender
- Tumble flaps?
- Door lock module
- Charcoal canister

Not sure if I've missed anything?

*zips up flame suit*

[neilw]

Interesting post. I think any 10-year-old car+ is going to have a significant number of potential issues. The trouble with the internet and forums is you only hear about issues and problems people are having, people don't come on here and start a post saying everything is working on their car. It can make the problems sound worse than they are. Yes all those things can happen to a car, your likely come across 3 or 4 of them. On your list I've got the rust and had to change my thermostat. If I wanted trouble free motoring I'd lease a 1.0 Skoda Fabia for £180 a month, for some thats perfect, but for me I'd find that dull as anything.

Cars are complicated things with lots that can and will go wrong and wear out at some point. My house is the same, it needs constant maintence too keep it up together.

I expect in our lifetime (I'm in my early 30's) we'll see the end of car ownership, we'll be moved about by self driving pods taxi things. Enjoy it while it lasts.

[TeamKHK]

I wouldn't say your points mentioned relate solely to the GTI, but also throughout the MK5 range and I can vouch for that. Check over the service history for my 10 year old GT TDI and you will find that in the past it's had some of the same things replaced - wheel bearings, springs, ABS, cruise control and more.

Since I took ownership of it two months ago - I've so far had to replace the bonnet catch, passenger side wing, springs again (slightly lowered though) & one door lock module. I agree though, Rust on these in general is a major concern as mine has tiny specs along the sills and the driver's side wing will need replacing in the near future due to the common corrosion. I reckon it will be the test of time to see how much MK5's really go through the rust ordeal as the years go by.

The one car I've owned out of all the rest that was totally trouble & rust free was my 04 plate 2.0 petrol Accord that I sold on not long ago. There again it was really looked after before I took ownership of it and I do believe that cars taken care of / properly maintained more than others generally do last longer as a whole.

The thing with Golf's in general as well and especially the likes of the GT / GTI models is that it can be tough to find one that has been properly looked and cared after because they are a sought after car & always will be as the generations go on.

Liam.

[Stobo91]

Picked my mk5 GTI up at the weekend after having a Mk4 1.8t for 5 years and first impressions are great. I know it’s kind of what you expect but it does everything the Mk4 did just so much better.
Although in this first week I’ve started getting error codes relating to the DV and the thermostat is acting up. Getting the follower done aswell so touch wood that should be all it needs for a while.

Bought it with bubbling on one front arch but hoping the warranty will sort that.


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[pudding]

A car's reliability and condition is directly proportional to the financial and time investment put into it.

Things like rust and component failure are unavoidable and we just deal with it.   It's not different to owning a house.  They don't last forever either, and the bills from neglect are considerably larger than the proactive maintenance costs.

The MK5 GTI is far from rubbish.  I've driven a few of the MK7 and 7.5 variants and they don't have anything like the same huge leap forward in handling and performance as demonstrated by the leap from MK4 to MK5.  That says a lot about the 5's core underpinnings.

Also bear in mind car makers deliberately don't make their products last forever, in the same way Apple don't want you to have an iPhone 4 forever. 

[Molesy]

In 4 years of ownership, other than services I've had to replace 1 DV, 1 door lock, rear calipers, rear springs, CV boots and had to grease the bonnet release that's not too bad for a car that will be 13 years old in 2 months but like any other old car i expect issues to pop up here and there but are their equivalents from Ford, Vauxhall, BMW, Renault, Jag etc any better? I can tell you they are not, all modern cars are complicated and have certain issues that affect that make/model.

They are generally reliable as long as they have been looked after well but tbf I can say that about any car! And of course anyone can be unlucky and have a critical failure sometimes its just a roll of the dice.

Molesy

[pudding]

In 4 years of ownership, other than services I've had to replace 1 DV, 1 door lock, rear calipers, rear springs, CV boots and had to grease the bonnet release that's not too bad for a car that will be 13 years old in 2 months but like any other old car i expect issues to pop up here and there but are their equivalents from Ford, Vauxhall, BMW, Renault, Jag etc any better? I can tell you they are not, all modern cars are complicated and have certain issues that affect that make/model.

They are generally reliable as long as they have been looked after well but tbf I can say that about any car! And of course anyone can be unlucky and have a critical failure sometimes its just a roll of the dice.

Molesy

Same with mine, apart from the door lock and bonnet release.  It's just standard wear and tear stuff and doesn't bother me.  All part of car ownership.

In spite of the common issues, these cars don't leave you stranded, they soldier on regardless.   It's only when you tune the hell out of them that engines and gearboxes fail......but that's of your own doing and not the car's fault      It's very rare that well maintained standard spec cars snap or blow something major.

[grey golfster]

I run 4 cars atm.

Tiguan, new 17 & Fiat 500, from new, now 6 yrs old.  Both of the above are experiencing issues, of one kind or another, which arguably should have been resolved by manufacturers!
Ed30, its all on here....as OP.
20 year old golf Cabby, which runs on fresh air, and last year's MOT +4 new tyres cost me <£200!

To me the greatest difference between these cars is that with a fantastic, free resource like this forum, I can quickly iron out most of the issues with my Eddy, based on probably millions of miles of experience by fellow enthusiasts.
As a reasonably high performance car, my modded eddy costs me buttons to run, in comparison to a similar BMW/Jag etc.

However, if push really came to shove, I'd keep the mk 3 cabby. A real cockroach car!

[Kai96]

I think the Mk5 is one of those cars if you've looked after it, it will look after you and it'll show. Personally never had any problems and Its coming up nearly 2 years I would of had her and I've always made sure it's maintained mechanically and everything is fine. A lot of these cars don't get looked after unfortunately and it does show as alot of people will buy one then come on here with loads of issues.

For me it isn't rubbish but it is a car that needs to be kept on top of maintenance wise and looked after or stuff can easily go wrong that's expensive to fix.

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[reflexsilverfox]

I'm with the op a little bit on this, i know when you buy a ten year old car you expect things to be wearing out and need replacing but there are a lot of things that mk5 gti's suffer with. I've probably changed more parts on my mk5 gti as preventative maintenance than my mk4, not great when you consider it's supposed to be a new improved version and my civic type r ep3 was so well behaved it was unreal - yes the ride wasn't as nice and it felt a bit cheaper but it just worked, never had to worry about changing this and that because it might break.

Don't get me wrong i prefer German cars but it disappoints me they cant match Japanese reliability at times.

I think this is my bank account talking typing this because i love my mk5, i think it's my bank account that doesn't   

[barelyrelevant]

I get how important it is to look after cars but I think a lot of the problems on the mk5 are not related to how well it has been looked after. I think if they were I would have been more understanding.

I'm sure "modern" cars made by other manufactures are the same, I would hate to think of the maintenance bills coming in 10+ years time for the cars which have been sold in the last ~4 years with all the electronics and emmission systems. Biggest problem for us enthusiasts is that they're almost impossible to work on without expensive diagnostic equipment.

Although by comparison we've had a 05 Honda Civic EP3 with 95k on it and an 03 Toyota Yaris 1.4d with 160k on it which didn't need any money spending on them apart from brakes and tyres.

[pudding]

Being realistic, no one is ever going to get all of that list happening at the same time, unless super unlucky!

DI engine coking is not unique to the GTI - Ford, BMW, GM et al all suffer the same problem.  It's a flaw of the design, not the car maker.

DSG faults are not unique to the GTI - Take the Evo X for example, which has a comical design flaw that prevents you from selecting any gears.  Box has to be stripped down to glue a sensor positioning magnet back on!  Doesn't happen on VWs.

Chain wear - It's a chain.  They wear out.  Again, not unique to VW.  They don't last forever on bikes either.

Rust is not unique to the GTI - It's steel and wants to return to it's natural iron oxide state.  No escaping that.  No steel body shell lasts forever.  It affects all cars, even Japanese ones.  If you live by the sea in a cold climate, you're on borrowed time.  If you live in Florida, not so much of a problem.

Failed PCV / DVs - Again, other cars use the same design and plastic and rubber is certainly not going to last forever.  GFB DV+ is a simple solution for that.

Cam follower - A bit of an internet folklore problem and not an issue on standard cars with a good oil changed in a timely fashion.

Tumble flaps - BMW 320ds used to consume them and bend intake valves.  That never happens on the GTI.

Blocked oil pickup -  I'll concede that is an annoying one, but it appears to be an issue with oil service intervals and/or oil quality and people spreading silicon on the sump like butter.

A/C compressor failure - never had that one but many cars suffer the same.  It's dependant on the brand of pump.  VW don't make those.

Wheel bearings - Ditto the chain.  It's a wear item and not a design flaw.

Whiteworm on the wheels -  Comes under wear and tear.  Any polished aluminum surface with lacquer is vulnerable to stone chips and then corrosion.  Seen on that on many other cars with that type of wheel surface.  It also comes under keeping on top of the maintenance if you want show room condition forever.

Thermostat failure - Again, not a unique problem to the GTI.  At least with this car it seizes open.  Try an E39 BMW with it's electrically controlled thermostat that jams shut, plus the part is 5x the cost of the GTI part.

ABS sender - <Stuck record> but cheap and easy to replace.

Charcoal canister - Really?  A plastic box has been listed as a flaw/problem?? 

Door lock module - They were a problem more on MK4s, and MK4s also used to lose their windows into the door frame all of a sudden    So long as the replacement part is an improved version (which it is), it's not a big deal and it's not like they fail every 6 months.

You didn't mention:-

Oil pump sprockets shearing off - pretty rare
Heavy oil consumption - doesn't affect all engines
Injector failure - Not really an issue until ~80K
Boost pipe bayonet rings leaking - General wear and tear
HPFP sensors cracking - Clumsy owners
Console bushes splitting - General wear and tear

Nothing on the GTI is unsolvable.  Plenty of improved parts, mods and advice online covering everything.   Where there's a will, there's inclination, but if the GTI is so bad, the solution is ebay, Autotrader or WBAC 

[Leco_GTI]

GTI's are the type of cars that people buy and beat the hell out of it. And it's supposed to be like this right? And if you abuse the car but keep everything in order you shouldn't worry much or you didn't do your homework properly. Taking a 2005 car, trashing it everywhere, neglect services + other maintenance and expect the car to be reliable in 2017 it's a bit of dream. It's the same with any performance car. You cannot compare a GTI to a Toyota Yaris, a Tiguan or anything that is not in the same category because most of them were not abused as performance cars usually are.

[pudding]

GTI's are the type of cars that people buy and beat the hell out of it. And it's supposed to be like this right? And if you abuse the car but keep everything in order you shouldn't worry much or you didn't do your homework properly. Taking a 2005 car, trashing it everywhere, neglect services + other maintenance and expect the car to be reliable in 2017 it's a bit of dream. It's the same with any performance car. You cannot compare a GTI to a Toyota Yaris, a Tiguan or anything that is not in the same category because most of them were not abused as performance cars usually are.

Yep.  In 10 years time people will be saying exactly the same thing about Golf Rs.  Beaten on for 2/3 years in lease deals and then flooded into the market with abuse related wear and tear, which will prompt the new owners to ask the same question. "Is the MK7 R actually pretty rubbish?"

A potential talking point for manual MK7 Rs is Miss-shifting a gear causing a blown engine.  It's happened to several people across the globe.  Is that VW's fault, or the owner's for trying to grab 2nd gear at 80mph?

[mk1mad]

I have owned my mk5 for nearly three years, the only problems I have had was sticky rear calipers (which I serviced £25), 1 cv boot, valve connected with carbon canister  and the seals on the boost pipes.
 Preventative maintenance, oil pick up pipe, cam follower, diverter valve, pcv valve.  All in pretty good for a 11 year old car and no sign of rust !