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Author Topic: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP, Injectors replacement - Results  (Read 3769 times)

Offline ZoliWorks

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Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP, Injectors replacement - Results
« on: December 15, 2024, 09:36:57 am »
Replacing my low pressure fuel pump has been on my to-do list for a while now and 2 days ago I got the job done. I ordered a VDO pump based on Autodoc's compatibility result. VDO part number for this is 228235070001Z and it came with a black seal ring, 1J0919133B. Initially I also ordered a pump controller module but it was an aftermarket unit, not oem so I decided not to keep it. I may get a new controller sometime next year if I'll have nothing else to spend on. The difference between the new pump and old pump is that the old one has a blue top, the new one has a white top.

The inscription on the pump reads A2C53107628 and has the production date stamped in that says 2022.

The OEM rubber seal ring was pinched. I made sure to not pinch mine when replacing it. The pump was never changed as it still had the original seal tape on it that was so brittle it broke into pieces when I tried to cut it.


As for the result...
Changing the pump made no difference whatsoever. Everything is the same as it was before. Still rough-ish cold starts and air noises every time I open my door after letting the car sit for a few hours. Since it wasn't the pump, i'm moving on to the next step: injectors or my hpfp are leaking.

Around march next year, I'll be replacing my injectors with brand new OEM Mk6 R injectors so I can finish the K04 swap and remap for 340-350hp since I'm remapped for stock injectors now. If that still doesnt change anything, I'll be buying and upgrading a brand new Hitachi HPFP. If still nothing changes, then I wont try anything else since it's just the cold start, no other issues.

Update 1: HPFP replacement
https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,134567.msg1165363.html#msg1165363













« Last Edit: Today at 11:40:20 am by ZoliWorks »
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline lazy

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2024, 11:12:11 am »
Worth a try and at least you now know that, that part is all working correctly.

Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2024, 08:43:30 pm »
Yeah, the pump was $100 so no regrets. I'll sell the old one for $40 and I at least know that I can rely on the new one when I push for more power.
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2025, 06:53:44 pm »
Back with an update after driving the car for some time. Cold starts are better than they used to be but I'm still losing rail pressure when left overnight.

On the plus side, the water trickling sound that the rear of the car used to make after stopping, is no more. The old pump likely had a failed/failing one way valve so for $100, this was a great refresh/replacement.

« Last Edit: January 03, 2025, 06:59:38 pm by ZoliWorks »
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline mjmallia

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2025, 10:25:24 am »
Good work. It was quite noticeable for me when I changed the pump. The remaining leak will most probably be the injectors then.
Mike

South Coast

S3 8L ---- Golf Mk4 GT TDI ---- Lupo GTI ----  A4 B6 Sline ---- Golf Mk5 GTI

Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2025, 05:37:54 pm »
Update again. Replaced HPFP with a Hüco unit. It's basically a Hitachi pump but with the Hitachi name grinded off and assembled in germany. After moving over the uprated internals, the pump seems to be more noisy than the old one under load. Cam follower was replaced with an INA part. Old one wasn't really worn out but figured might as well do it.

Now the thing is, I cant tell if it's my pump that sounds different or if my turbo has developed enough play to make noise while under load.

Changing the pump changed absolutely nothing. Fuel is still draining out of the fuel rail after letting the car sit. I'm changing the injectors with brand new oem S3 ones and installing a new oem rs4 fprv before getting remapped. Hopefully this will sort my fuel leak issues.


« Last Edit: February 10, 2025, 09:11:57 pm by ZoliWorks »
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline Mekaniko

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2025, 11:36:43 am »
I've been searching for the long cold start on AXX-BWA for years and never found the solution. I don't want to start changing parts without a clear pad... injectors? Who knows.

Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: LPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2025, 09:06:56 pm »
I've been searching for the long cold start on AXX-BWA for years and never found the solution. I don't want to start changing parts without a clear pad... injectors? Who knows.

I'll update this post once I fit the injectors. Ordered them today and should arrive tomorrow, but will only be fitting next week when I'm also remapping for a proper k04 tune.

I have:
  • New Continental LPFP
  • New Hüco HPFP with VIS Internals
Soon:
  • New S3 Injectors and a complete mounting kit (seals, baskets etc)
  • New Fuel Pressure Release Valve
  • New Bosch N80 Valve

It has to be something on the high pressure side of the HPFP/Fuel Rail. When I unbolted the high pressure side from the pump, nothing came out. Literally 0 fuel. When I did the low pressure side, some fuel came out. The LPFP relay was disconnected for an entire day at that point so it didn't pump any fuel when I opened the door.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2025, 03:53:10 pm by ZoliWorks »
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline mjmallia

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Re: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2025, 07:34:27 am »
Changing my LPFP made a big difference for me, as the old pump must have been worn out at 120K miles.

I am taking out my injectors tomorrow to change the baskets, seals and generally clean/service them......as been seeing loads on basket failures recently.........every little bit helps and it is preventative maintenance in my eyes.

At the same time I am also going to check on the inlet valves while it is all off as cleaned them 20k miles ago, curious to there condition as they were really bad when I did them the first time.

All parts collected and have the day off to attack it  :scared: :grin:
Mike

South Coast

S3 8L ---- Golf Mk4 GT TDI ---- Lupo GTI ----  A4 B6 Sline ---- Golf Mk5 GTI

Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2025, 04:00:26 pm »
Another thing I've heard is that the fuel lines can develop cracks and air can get through them, into the fuel feed. If all else fails, this is also something I wanna look into. I'll replace certain parts of the fuel lines with transparent tubes just to see what's up while the engine is running.

Good luck with your injector stuff!
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #10 on: Yesterday at 09:36:45 pm »
Alright, back with an update, nothing changed really...

New injectors, complete injector seal kit, new fprv, new rail pressure sensor, new n80 evap valve, new lambda, new tune.

The car starts pretty much the same when cold. Spins up, hangs a bit then slowly comes to life. There's still that annoying air noise when I open the door and the electric fuel pump starts pumping.

I've legit run out of ideas at this point. The only other thing I was thinking about doing is changing the rubber fuel lines as they are quite worn out at this point.


Anyway, here's 3 clips with cold starts and then a 4th clip with a hot start

Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm


Offline mjmallia

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Re: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #11 on: Today at 08:25:57 am »
Sounds quite healthy to me........maybe a split sec longer than mine on a cold crank, otherwise acceptable for the TFSI.......heard a lot worse than that

Mike

South Coast

S3 8L ---- Golf Mk4 GT TDI ---- Lupo GTI ----  A4 B6 Sline ---- Golf Mk5 GTI

Offline ZoliWorks

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Re: Cold start issues - LPFP, HPFP replacement - Results
« Reply #12 on: Today at 11:38:48 am »
That is exactly what my tuner told me, who specializes in these engines. He told me it's normal for the TFSI and that I shouldn't be trying to fix something that aint broken when it comes to these engines specifically.


edit: this is a different tuner from the one I had up till now. After I kept bugging the old one about how sh*t my car was running, he just up and blocked me cause he was also in the process of moving shop. Why did I go with him in the first place? cause I didnt know anyone who knew these engines in my area, while he claimed that he's been doing them for 20 years and because I was a broke college student at the time so money was an issue.

We went through the map with this new tuner and basically it was awful. The engine was running so lean it was literally begging to be killed. He messed with the VVT values to make the car sound louder, he messed with the ESP skid control values to make the car much more likely to spin wheels. He messed with the wheelspin part of the ESP unit, making it a hardcut limiter so every time I'd start spinning, it'd cut power, let off boost and then resume. When on the highway and using the cruise control to increase speed, the car would go into full boost, then let off boost, then full boost, then off boost again, basically jerking you back and forth as it was trying to accelerate. Under hard acceleration in 3rd or 4th gears, the car would jerk left and right, losing traction here and there, trying to drag you side to side. The engine was also overall much louder at idle, at normal driving, at hard acceleration etc. The boost was also not controlled whatsoever. He basically set the boost from 2.5k all the way to redline to be 1.55 bar. He also changed the values the gas pedal was seeing. When it was at 30%, it was giving 55%. When at 50%, it was giving 99% or something along those lines.


With the new tune the new guy reverted back to the stock N75 values, reverted back the VVT changes as I've seen the car at times go as high as 32 degrees, set the boost to 1.4 and I forgot how much at redline but much lower. He also made some changes to the ESP when accelerating so now with ESP on it feels like I'm driving on snow. I can floor it, the ESP light will flash but the car wont cut out, wont jerk, it will just get up to speed with minimal to no wheel spin. Also no more wheel hop whatsoever. The car is also a lot more quiet overall, both under full load and when just driving normally.

The only thing I dont like is how the turbo no longer makes that stututu sound when I let off the gas since that was the most unique part about it imo. Once I'm done with the anti surge core conversion, he said he'll add back the stututu.
« Last Edit: Today at 01:59:18 pm by ZoliWorks »
Mk5 Jetta 2.0 TFSI BWA | Manual | Mk6 GTI Front | BorgWarner K04 Turbo | Sachs X-Tend OEM+ Clutch Kit | Ta-Technix Air Intake | Ta-Technix 200 Cell Downpipe | Ta-Technix Intercooler | S3 Injectors | Vis Motorsport 175 bar HPFP | 350hp 480nm