DRLs - anyone tried these? ** now with pics on pg10 **

[RedRobin]

^ They're looking really excellent in position in those pics  

[PND]

^^^^
They're looking really excellent in position in those pics 

If only I knew how to wire the bl**dy things in!!! 

[PND]

The other option is to open up the control unit of the LEDs and you will probably find its either done one of two ways. Either PIC controled using a PWM signal which is very unlikley due to cost or a relay that switches it to a track on the PCB with a resistor in when it sensors the side lights have been turned on, In witch case you simply remove the reistor and they will not be on when your lights are on.

As you can see from the pic, the dimmer control is a sealed unit, so no chance of altering anything inside that I don't think.

[RedRobin]

Robin,
Iirc you looked up the laws when you started to think about DRL for yours. Can you remember what the law states?

....That's quite a contentious issue! T_T and myself have had endless debates about what is law and what isn't re DRL's. To try to clarify, I did a large amount of research on the internet and found lots of very extensive reports and studies, mostly done at national level and including surveys of public opinion. Unfortunately I didn't keep copies I could refer to now and I came across them through surfing from one piece of info to another. Some of this information I found did include what was law in particular countries. I didn't expect to have to later defend my actions!

At the time, about 2 years ago, the UK studies/research was finding that there was substantial public resistance here - Mostly due to Volvo headlight associations and motorbikers at least very understandably objecting if DRL's were at headlight height. I don't know of any specific laws about DRL's in the UK but that doesn't mean there aren't any. Certainly, to comply with some European countries (countries in Europe and not necessarily EC) they need to operate as mine do.

Currently, I think mostly due to German cars being imported here with oem DRL's, the British public have become much more aware of DRL's and I remember reading in the studies and proposals that there would be a transition period before laws were finally in place in which even the use of foglights might be allowed! Personally, I believe strongly that DRL's should be both dedicated units and LED because that type of light functions far better for daytime running - Hence my dislike of the Mk6 Golf and similar solutions. IMO they should be as the Golf and Rocco R's.

My purpose in research was to ensure that whatever I did wasn't going to get me into trouble and so I followed Hella's installation instructions. My VW dealer was happy to connect them differently but agreed that I was doing the most sensible thing.

HTH  

[Snoopy]

Thanks Robin, I did not realise TT and yourself had discussed this to dealth  


The connections in the instructions for these DRL above.

WHITE
I would say is the Sidelight signal due to going to the headlight so basically telling the control unit when to dim.
Easy to test stick a multimeter or a bulb between the #10 wire on the headlight and the minus of the battery. See if its live all the time or just when the lights are turned on.

RED
Due to the fuse size the red one i would say to be the power to the control unit and LEDs and only gets power when the Ignition is on.

BLACK
Is your ground so can go to the minus terminal of the battery or an earth point.


Im guessing but maybe when they say number 2 connection what connection is on the foglight plug? Maybe the foglights have a perminant ignition switched 12V to them and only turn on when the foglight switch connects them to ground? Or theres a plug in that other photo there that has a number 2 on it i cannot see it very well on the scanned copy.

I would say you can take the red wire to a switched live somewere.

[PND]

The connections in the instructions for these DRL above.

White
I would say is the Sidelight signal due to going to the headlight so basically telling the control unit when to dim.
Easy to test stick a multimeter or a bulb between the #10 wire on the headlight and the minus of the battery. See if its live all the time or just when the lights are turned on.

Due to the fuse size the red one i would say to be the power to the control unit and LEDs

The black is your ground so can go to the minus terminal of the battery or an earth point.

Im guessing but maybe when they say number 2 connection what connection is on the foglight plug? Maybe the foglights have a perminant ignition switched 12V to them and only turn on when the foglight switch connects them to ground?

I would say you can take the red wire to a switched live somewere.

Thanks a lot for that Snoopy.  I might have a go tomorrow and see what happens.  I only wish I knew more about the electrical side of things!

[Snoopy]

I edited it abit so it was a bit easier to understand.

If it does work how i think. Then its quite easy to change it by adding in a relay into the red and white wires so it only turns the LEDs on when you have no other lights on.

[PND]

Thanks again Snoopy - I think I've got it now!

Never has there been so much Shadow Blue on a thread! 

[Teutonic_Tamer]

Thanks T_T for that. 

Unfortunately, the wires have nothing written on them.  There are just the round terminal connectors on the black, but nothing on the red or white.

I've just checked on my car (as I couldn't remember otherwise) and the sidelights stay on when the headlights are on as well.  So, from that, it looks as if the DRLs will be on all the time - full brightness when all headlights/sidelights are off and then dimmed when either headlights or sidelights are on.  This is how I thought they would function.  I suppose the only way to turn them off totally would be to wire in a separate switch (as mentioned by Stu earlier in the thread).

That is exactly how they are meant to work.  There is categorically NO requirement (legal or otherwise) which states they must go off when using either side lights or head lights.

[stealthwolf]

...NO requirement (legal or otherwise) which states they must go off when using either side lights or head lights...

Is there a way to wire these so they function like RR's DRLs? ie go off when using side/dipped/main?

[Snoopy]

Yes if they work like i expect this should work. You simply need a standard 5 pin relay to add into the wiring as shown below.



The only question is if this upsets the diagnostics or not due to the resistance of the coil in the relay but in theory the low resistance of the bulb in parallel with the relay (your side light bulb) will compensate so not cause an error signal.

[Teutonic_Tamer]

What do we generally think about DRLs being on all the time, dimming when other lights are on?  Is this how they work on Audis for instance?  What happens on the mk6 Golf?  Do they go off altogether?

....What I think is common knowledge here but I think there's a case for setting them up to automatically switch on with ignition and auto switch off whenever any of the other oem lights are actioned to be on. That's how mine are.

No Robin, that is ONLY your point of view.  The law - to which those in this thread have been European Type Approved (with their 'E' number) makes NO requirement that they have to go off when the normal lights are on.

They've passed MOT twice and more recently a Police stop and full inspection with an apology from them. The Police liked the fact that mine went off whenever other lights came on.

Completely irrelevant.  Illegal retro-fit HIDs pass MoTs - but that categorically does NOT make them 'legal'.  And the Police often don't know the law.  I regularly see chavs with blue bulbs being passed by coppers - but the coppers CBA stopping them.  And I'm sure we all know without a shadow of a doubt that blue bulbs are illegal on any vehicle except official emergency services vehicles!

I don't see the point of them self-dimming unless they are amongst the indicator cluster as on some Audi's.

Again, that is your point of view.  They have an E number, which means they are 100% legal to dim.

As your car will retain the fogs you perhaps need them to go off whenever your fogs are on.

Why?

Personally, I dislike the yellow appearance of the stock Mk6 Golf 'DRLs' and they're not very bright either.

Now that I do agree with.  But the Golf 6 DRLs are not LED - they are just tungsten filament bulbs running at reduced wattage - exactly the same as the B7 A4/S4/RS4.  But I tweaked mine in VCDS, and now they are much whiter.  But this thread isn't about Mk6 Golfs, or even Audis - it is about the specific DRLs listed in the OP.

[Teutonic_Tamer]

....What I think is common knowledge here but I think there's a case for setting them up to automatically switch on with ignition and auto switch off whenever any of the other oem lights are actioned to be on. That's how mine are. They've passed MOT twice and more recently a Police stop and full inspection with an apology from them. The Police liked the fact that mine went off whenever other lights came on.

I don't see the point of them self-dimming unless they are amongst the indicator cluster as on some Audi's.

As your car will retain the fogs you perhaps need them to go off whenever your fogs are on.

Personally, I dislike the yellow appearance of the stock Mk6 Golf 'DRLs' and they're not very bright either.

Robin,
Iirc you looked up the laws when you started to think about DRL for yours. Can you remember what the law states?

Robin has never been able to point to or quote any law which supports is own point of view.  From what I can gather, Robin is simply going on what his installation instructions advised.  I don't even know if Robins DRLs are 'E' approved, though I'll gladly be willing to be corrected.

I have two family members who are senior road traffic police (one who specialises in Construction and Use Regulations), and a further who is a road traffic police civvy trainer - and NONE support Robins POV, but they DO agree that the 'Audi' way is perfectly legal.

Simply fitting a relay into the power line to the LED or the LED control unit  that turns the power to them off when theres power to the sidelight is easy to do.

The other option is to open up the control unit of the LEDs and you will probably find its either done one of two ways. Either PIC controled using a PWM signal which is very unlikley due to cost or a relay that switches it to a track on the PCB with a resistor in when it sensors the side lights have been turned on, In witch case you simply remove the reistor and they will not be on when your lights are on.

Both completely un-necessary.  If they function as described by following the wiring instructions, then they are perfectly legal.

[Snoopy]

Simply fitting a relay into the power line to the LED or the LED control unit  that turns the power to them off when theres power to the sidelight is easy to do.

The other option is to open up the control unit of the LEDs and you will probably find its either done one of two ways. Either PIC controled using a PWM signal which is very unlikley due to cost or a relay that switches it to a track on the PCB with a resistor in when it sensors the side lights have been turned on, In witch case you simply remove the reistor and they will not be on when your lights are on.

Both completely un-necessary.  If they function as described by following the wiring instructions, then they are perfectly legal.

They maybe perfectly legal but that does not meen everyone wants them on when there other lights are on im simply giving an option.



For other types of DRLs others maybe looking to fit it maybe useful info, if its true, the info on the hella site for DRL says legal requirments on height and width on the fitted units are as follows.
From ground min 250mm  max of 1500mm
width apart min of 600mm

[PND]

I'm really grateful for the advice and opinions that you've all been giving.  It does seem that this particular set of DRLs are intended to stay on all the time and just dim when any other lights are on.  I think initially that that is how I'll wire them.  However, the advice on how to configure them to switch off totally, when other lights come on, is extremely useful as it gives me the option should I want it.

I bought these DRLs for two reasons.  Firstly, because I wanted some.  Secondly, because no-one else on here (AFAIK) had bought them so I am acting a bit as a guinea pig on behalf of the forum.

I'll probably give it a go tomorrow, but may well need some more assistance if I am struggling.

Thank you all again for your help so far.

Paul.