Warning to those that dont declare mods to insurance

[Richn83]

Thats a different situation if they ask, most dont and from a legal stand point if they dont ask you then you dont have to voluntarily declare, unless you modify during a policy period.  The onus is on the insuring party to request all relevant information before offering insurance. (this is from an under-writer I know who works on the Lloyds exchange.  So if they dont ask for factory equipment then they wont load it into there model and it wont be a requirement of your insurance.  You will obviously have to prove they were on the car but that should be easy enough form the charred remains  

So say you have bought a modified vehicle secondhand. You ring up for insurance and they dont ask if the vehicle is modified. Using your theory you don't tell them. You then have a crash and make a claim. The insurance company then finds the car is modified......

I wonder if you would get paid out?

Me thinks not. As the saying goes - Ignorance is no defence in law.

Buying a second hand car that someone has tampered with and not being aware of the modifications is a whole different kettle of fish and I wasnt talking about that, my post was simply from a discussion I have had with someone who has passed his exams in insurance law so he can under-write on the Lloyds exchange, and under UK law it is the responsibility of the insurance company in a retail environment to ask all pertinent questions to asses the risk and apply a suitable policy/premium not the responsibility of the person applying for the insurance to offer all relevant information, so as long as you accurately respond to all questions asked then your insurance will be valid.

[vRS Carl]

So your saying if i change my insurance company to insure my heavily modified vRS, they don't ask me if it's modified or not and i don't decalre the modifications i would be insured in the event of an accident???

I would be extremley surprised if that was the case. I'm pretty sure that they would hire some fancy lawyer and do me for fraud. I couldn't afford Mr loopholes £10k a day fee and i highly doubt the defence of "Now listen here ducky. I was on MK5Gti and a forum member had a discussion with someone who said it was fine" would wash

[Poverty]

So your saying if i change my insurance company to insure my heavily modified vRS, they don't ask me if it's modified or not and i don't decalre the modifications i would be insured in the event of an accident???

I would be extremley surprised if that was the case. I'm pretty sure that they would hire some fancy lawyer and do me for fraud. I couldn't afford Mr loopholes £10k a day fee and i highly doubt the defence of "Now listen here ducky. I was on MK5Gti and a forum member had a discussion with someone who said it was fine" would wash

Mr.Loophole now has is own firm, you can hire one of his "understudies" for much less, but this sorta thing isnt what they specialise in anyway lol

[s4lek]

Would you declare non performance enhancing mods , such as osir paddles , led lights chrome switches carbonio intake , kn filter etc etc. 

[MAT ED30]

Would you declare non performance enhancing mods , such as osir paddles , led lights chrome switches carbonio intake , kn filter etc etc. 

i would if i was you

[JPC]

Would you declare non performance enhancing mods , such as osir paddles , led lights chrome switches carbonio intake , kn filter etc etc. 

I dont see why people arent getting this yet.

Insurance companies are out to make money, they are just like any other business.

You insure a standard car. If you modify this, they will want to know. If they dont know, and you have an accident, your giving them ammo to not pay out. They sometimes dont even need to prove the said item caused the accident.

Non performance or not, its worth telling them. They normally charge an admin fee for stuff like that, so do loads in one hit and youll be fine!

[Richn83]

So your saying if i change my insurance company to insure my heavily modified vRS, they don't ask me if it's modified or not and i don't decalre the modifications i would be insured in the event of an accident???

I would be extremley surprised if that was the case. I'm pretty sure that they would hire some fancy lawyer and do me for fraud. I couldn't afford Mr loopholes £10k a day fee and i highly doubt the defence of "Now listen here ducky. I was on MK5Gti and a forum member had a discussion with someone who said it was fine" would wash

I'm certainly not saying do it Carl and please dont drag me into the court case if you do!    just my understanding of retail insurance law in the UK, if they dont ask you to supply the information then you dont have to supply it off your own back.  you would of course still be bound to the terms of the insurance contract, so there is no chance of accidentally getting your modified car insured in the UK as standard legitimately.  my comments were more related to the factory fit equipment if they dont ask you to supply how swanky your car is and you provide accurate information to all questions answered then you should have no issue with legality of a claim.  

[stealthwolf]

But if it is placed on at the factory (i.e. car built to order) then how can they say it's not "standard"

Any optional extras that are factory-fitted are supposed to be "standard" - ie there are no aftermarket modifications.

in vags there is a number somewhere stored on the car which tells the dealer which options the car left the factory with.

+1.

It should be law that insurance can not be higher than the value of the car. They either insure you for less or they simply say sorry we can't insure you

Although most people think about their own vehicles, it goes beyond this. The insurance isn't there just to cover your car. It's to cover the any costs that arise. Let's say you crash into a Bugatti Veyron and it's your fault. The Veyron is a write-off. Given that it was your fault, the money for a new Veyron should come out of your pocket. Except it doesn't - your insurance company pays the veyron owner's insurance the money.

So say you have bought a modified vehicle secondhand. You ring up for insurance and they dont ask if the vehicle is modified. Using your theory you don't tell them. You then have a crash and make a claim. The insurance company then finds the car is modified......I wonder if you would get paid out?

Technically, they would have to. In reality, they would all ask this question and at the very least, it would be on the paperwork as the car being "unmodified".

[vRS Carl]

It should be law that insurance can not be higher than the value of the car. They either insure you for less or they simply say sorry we can't insure you

Although most people think about their own vehicles, it goes beyond this. The insurance isn't there just to cover your car. It's to cover the any costs that arise. Let's say you crash into a Bugatti Veyron and it's your fault. The Veyron is a write-off. Given that it was your fault, the money for a new Veyron should come out of your pocket. Except it doesn't - your insurance company pays the veyron owner's insurance the money.

I understand how premiums work and what they pay for. However my point is that insurers could do more to help. For example if they charged a 17yr, old who has just passed their test, say £500 a year to insure a £1200 car i think that more of them would pay insurance. No one should have to pay a yearly premium of more than there car is worth. Thats effectively paying for 2 cars but only having one. I know you have to have insurance and i know nobody is legally bound to cover you. But they would get more business by doing something like that.

I am in know way condoning at any time not paying insurance or not declaring modifications.

[JPC]

Why should a 17 year old not pay more than the value of the car?

They can easily go out and do £5m worth of damage, and if that sector/age group are more likely to do it, there is an associated cost no?

[vRS Carl]

Why should a 17 year old not pay more than the value of the car?

They can easily go out and do £5m worth of damage, and if that sector/age group are more likely to do it, there is an associated cost no?

Ok then so say for arguments sake your car that you drive now is worth £10k and your insurance co. said to you "right chap that will be £15k of the queens schilling to insure you as you might drive into a vehicle transporter loaded with 10 supercars and cause £10m of damage"

What would you do? Insure the car, Not insure the car or not drive?

I know what my answer would be and it's not drive.

The point im making is that by charging such high amounts for 17yr olds they are feeding the problem. As i said if they said "come to us. Drive a 1.2 Fiesta for a couple of years to build up some no claims, get some driving experience and we will charge you £500 a year". They would get more business and the roads would probably be a lot safer.

[vRStu]

I can see the point Elephant were making in asking about factory options as it affects the value of the vehicle, what I couldn't deal with was the argument on replacing with different parts.

As an example - if a base model S3 is around £30k but someone buys one with bucket seats & exclusive paint he's added £4k to the price and hence in his opinion £4k to the insured value.  If Elephant rate a car based on it's minimum specification they would be out of pocket on this one but if they rated every car on the premise of having £4k of options then everyone would be paying for cover they don't need.

[RedRobin]

I can see the point Elephant were making in asking about factory options as it affects the value of the vehicle, what I couldn't deal with was the argument on replacing with different parts.

As an example - if a base model S3 is around £30k but someone buys one with bucket seats & exclusive paint he's added £4k to the price and hence in his opinion £4k to the insured value.  If Elephant rate a car based on it's minimum specification they would be out of pocket on this one but if they rated every car on the premise of having £4k of options then everyone would be paying for cover they don't need.

....But isn't this countered by the fact that each policy is individual? So, as insurers such as Greenlight do, each policy accommodates the individual car and not a generic lowest common denominator. Insured replacement like-for-like is partly why I chose them. Furthermore, more and more cars are being offered 'standard' ex-factory with a wide variety of options.

[Janner_Sy]

For the other part, then it should be the Aussie system (I'm sure some others have it too) of the Rego and everyone automatically having 3rd party insurance.

I'd be happy with that system and you just pay extra to have fully comp

this is the same in south aftica.  All cars have cover.  but to do this they would have to increase road tax to compensate

[RedRobin]

So your doing some spirited driving in your modified mk5 which is declared yes.

Then you have an accident and the Police prove that you were speeding and therefore breaking the road laws contravening the road traffic act hence invalidating your insurance!

....Sorry but I don't understand that bit! Since when does insurance become invalid because you broke traffic laws?  

It only becomes invalid if you didn't declare your car's modifications.