Brake fluid Information

[the bruce]

Tony, advanced DOT4 fluids may exceed DOT5.1 boiling point, but DOT5.1 fluids
have a lower viscosity. This complements the fast moving ESP valves.

I don't want to say that ESP doesn't work with DOT4 but that doesn't affect
the difference in viscosity.

Does VW really recommend DOT5.1? Thought they just use DOT4 in our cars,
but I might be wrong of course.

 

[tony_danza]

I was working on the assumption they'd told him to keep stock spec stuff, not 100% what VW spec is though???

[the bruce]

To be honest I never read an official statement which fluid they fill from factory.
Maybe VW have their own fluid.
But of course all DOT4 and DOT5.1 work well in all modern VAG platform cars.

[Teutonic_Tamer]

Probably sitting on the side of caution, as VW spec DOT5.1 and they'd not want to tell you to use DOT4 and have the 0.00001% chance of it causing a problem.

No they don't.  VW used to spec DOT4 upto 2007, but they now have their own unique spec - VW 501.14 - which exceeds DOT4 wet and dry boiling points by some margin, but more importantly, is a special low viscosity fluid. 

[the bruce]

VW sometimes go the 'exclusive' route.
Why don't they use a common 'industrial standard' DOT5.1 ??

[Teutonic_Tamer]

VW sometimes go the 'exclusive' route.
Why don't they use a common 'industrial standard' DOT5.1 ??

Because, despite that clear 'copy and paste' in the orginal post of this thread - DOT5.1 does NOT include any 'low viscosity' specification.  The Conti Teves MK60 ESP (and all Teves ESP units) are notorious for failing - due to fluid which is beyond specification (non low visc fluid, dirty fluid, old fluid, water contamination, etc).

VW has their own exclusive spec, as does Mercedes-Benz (http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/331.0_en.html and http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/331.1_en.html), Renault, BMW, Fiat, and probably many more.

It must be remembered that 'DOT' is a United States specification, and just like the yankie API engine oil standards - are basically way too inferior for European spec motors - hence all the OEM specs.

[gobbleplease]

VW sometimes go the 'exclusive' route.
Why don't they use a common 'industrial standard' DOT5.1 ??

Because, despite that clear 'copy and paste' in the orginal post of this thread - DOT5.1 does NOT include any 'low viscosity' specification.  The Conti Teves MK60 ESP (and all Teves ESP units) are notorious for failing - due to fluid which is beyond specification (non low visc fluid, dirty fluid, old fluid, water contamination, etc).

VW has their own exclusive spec, as does Mercedes-Benz (http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/331.0_en.html and http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/331.1_en.html), Renault, BMW, Fiat, and probably many more.

It must be remembered that 'DOT' is a United States specification, and just like the yankie API engine oil standards - are basically way too inferior for European spec motors - hence all the OEM specs.

And whats your point ?? It was a copy and paste and if you noticed at the bottom i thanked the original author for the info !

[the bruce]

Posted this already on another thread: 



AP Racing 551 - DOT 3 - 527°F (275°C) / 302ºF (145ºC)

AP Racing 600 - DOT 3 - 590°F (310°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT 4 - 608°F (320ºC) / 311°F (155ºC)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 -  509°F (265°C) / 347°F (175°C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 396ºF (194ºC) (Tipp)

Ate Super 200 - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 382ºF (194ºC) (Tipp)

BMW OEM  - DOT 4 - 446*F (224°) / 311*F (156°)

Bosch - DOT 3 - 491ºF (255ºC) / 288ºF (142ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 329ºF (165ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4+ - 536ºF (280ºC) / 356ºF (180ºC)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT 4 - 601ºF (316ºC) / 399ºF (204ºC)  !!!

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT 4 - 520ºF (271ºC) / 336ºF (169ºC)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Castrol SRF - DOT 4 - 590ºF (310ºC) / 518ºF (270ºC)  !!!

Endless RF-650 - DOT4? -  612°F (323°C) / 425°F (218°C)  !!!

GS610 - DOT 4 - 610°F (321°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Gunk HD - DOT 4 - 510ºF (266ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT 5.1 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 365ºF (185ºC)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT 4 - 594ºF (312ºC) / 421ºF (216ºC) (Tipp)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT 4 - 617ºF (325ºC) / 400ºF (204ºC) (Tipp)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT 4 - 610°F (322°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Pentosin Super - DOT 4 - 500°F (260°C) / 338°F (170°C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT 5.1 - 572°F (300°C) / 392ºF (200°C) (Tipp)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT 4 - 683°F (360°C) / 439°F (224°C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT 3/4 - 527ºF (275ºC) / 347ºF (175ºC)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT 3 - 570ºF (299ºC) / 284ºF (140ºC)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT 4 - 633ºF (330ºC) / 417ºF (213ºC)



VW has it's own spec J 1704 FMVS16 Audi/VW 501.14. At least Ate SL6 meets this spec.

http://www.ate.de/generator/www/com/de/ate/ate/themen/10_produkte/30_bremsfluessigkeiten/download/bf_flyer_pdf_de.pdf

Ate SL6 has a dry boiling point of 265° C and a wet bp of 175° C. The low temp is at max.
700 mm²/s (Super 200 and Super Blue Racing are at max 1400 mm²/s).


 

[the bruce]

I think 5.1 is not the right brake fluid.

4.1 is the right one.

DOT5.1 is fine (DOT5 would NOT).

There's not "4.1", just DOT4 which is also fine.

[Kiwi]

I use this one, with no issues at all - Fast or Slow

Ate Super Blue - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 396ºF (194ºC) (Tipp)

[the bruce]

some more added


Make..........DOT Rating......dry and wet boiling point



AP Racing 551 - DOT 3 - 527°F (275°C) / 302ºF (145ºC)

AP Racing 600 - DOT 3 - 590°F (310°C) / 410°F (210°C)

AP PRF Racing - DOT 4 - 608°F (320ºC) / 311°F (155ºC)

Ate SL6 - DOT4 + ISO6 -  509°F (265°C) / 347°F (175°C)

Ate Super Blue - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

Ate Super 200 - DOT 4 - 536ºF (280ºC) / 390ºF (194ºC)

BMW OEM  - DOT 4 - 446*F (224°) / 311*F (156°)

Bosch - DOT 3 - 491ºF (255ºC) / 288ºF (142ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 329ºF (165ºC)

Bosch - DOT 4+ - 536ºF (280ºC) / 356ºF (180ºC)

Brembo LCF 600+ - DOT 4 - 601ºF (316ºC) / 399ºF (204ºC)

Brembo EVO 500+ - DOT 4 - 520ºF (271ºC) / 336ºF (169ºC)

Castrol GT LMA - DOT 4 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Castrol SRF - DOT 4 - 590ºF (310ºC) / 518ºF (270ºC)

Endless RF-650 - DOT4 -  612°F (323°C) / 425°F (218°C)

GS610 - DOT 4 - 610°F (321°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Gunk HD - DOT 4 - 510ºF (266ºC) / 311ºF (155ºC)

Motul DOT 5.1 - DOT 5.1 - 509ºF (265ºC) / 365ºF (185ºC)

Motul RBF 600 - DOT 4 - 594ºF (312ºC) / 421ºF (216ºC)

Motul RBF 660 - DOT 4 - 617ºF (325ºC) / 400ºF (204ºC)

Neo Super DOT16 - DOT 4 - 610°F (322°C) / 421°F (216°C)

Pentosin Super - DOT 4 - 500°F (260°C) / 338°F (170°C)

Pentosin RBF - DOT 4 - 572°F (300°C) / 392ºF (200°C)

Performance Friction RH665 - DOT 4 - 617°F (325°C) / 395°F (195°C)

Project µ G-four 335 - DOT 4 - 634°F (335°C) / 429°F (221°C)

Prospeed RS683 - DOT 4 - 683°F (360°C) / 439°F (224°C)

TAR•OX Roadrace - DOT 4 - 583°F (314°C) / 401°F (205°C)

ValvolineProSyn - DOT 3/4 - 527ºF (275ºC) / 347ºF (175ºC)

Wilwood Hi-Temp 570 - DOT 3 - 570ºF (299ºC) / 284ºF (140ºC)

Wilwood EXP600 Plus - DOT 4 - 633ºF (330ºC) / 417ºF (213ºC)