Motech mapped DSG 'hesitation' after gear change - FIXED. R-TECH Reign supreme

[R-tech-Nick]

N75 PID controller occilations is your cause dude..

 The requested ramp rate of the boost is far to low and linear for a basic 1bar tune.

  KFLDIMX ( i pilot N75% control on spool up) is a little to aggressive for the profile of the LDRXN (boost/load request curve)  ECU seeing 250mb of boost overshoot around 2500rpm the ecu via PID controllers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller is trying to bring the boost in line. The problem is when controlling boost with around 50% DC is that the N75 is more like an on off swicth and is hard to get linear control in short period of time. 

  Easy fix would be set the LDRXN boost/load profile to match the actual boost by requesting the boost to spool and peak to 2250mb, Plus the ecu finds it hard to hold a flat line boost your map is 2000mb flat line which keeps N75 around that 50% mark,  maybe worth going for 2080/2090mb to ride the n75 close to 60%. 

I am sure Mike will find this area and cure it for you.
Nick

Makes perfect sense to me. 

lol
Read up about PID controllers you will understand it lots better. PID controllers play a huge part in the Bosch ecus and mapping

I have a 4500 page German Bosch MED9 TFSI functions PDF which explains every thing about your ecus,   If I can find a good site to share the file I will try and post it up here I makes good reading and sheds a lot of light on a lot of post remap issues.

Nick

[mervman]

To be clear the torque limit I have issue with is the post up-shift torque dwell, not the in gear element. The peak torque on a dyno run is still being modulated by the DSG gearbox (which I accept) at around 280 lb/ft.

I will draw a crude graph to show what I mean.



The reason it bugs me is that it totally negates the benefit of the DSG - I'm far from a driving legend, but the torque interuption I introduce when shifting my manaul track car is seemingly less noticeable, though I've not quantified this with a Vbox or similar. I know from driving the other day with a friend in a fairly spirited manner, that when my car changes gear he pulls on me in a way that shouldn't happen.

As I exhausted conversation (a while ago) regarding the map being the cause the torque-dwell, I don't mind disclosing that it is a Shark map on my car, as Heavyd has eluded to.

perfect graph showing the issue.

AS soon as i get my car back I'll be back at Motech trying to sort the issue.. the good thing is they also seem committed to sorting it out and are not just telling me to live with it.

Hi guys.

Sorry for the thread resurrection, but I've been having a similar issue with my stage 2 remapped GTI.
I notice a hesitation when changing gear at wide open throttle approxmately around 3k RPM. Foot flat in second gear and if I change up to 3rd at about 3K RPM it changes gear fast but then there's a delay before the power comes back on strong. It only does this around 3-5k RPM The car still pulls hard, nothing wrong with the power I don't think.

jedi-knight83- did you finally sort it out 100%?

Thanks very much!
M

[RedRobin]

Hi guys.

Sorry for the thread resurrection, but I've been having a similar issue with my stage 2 remapped GTI.
I notice a hesitation when changing gear at wide open throttle approxmately around 3k RPM. Foot flat in second gear and if I change up to 3rd at about 3K RPM it changes gear fast but then there's a delay before the power comes back on strong. It only does this around 3-5k RPM The car still pulls hard, nothing wrong with the power I don't think.

....Firstly, A Very Warm Welcome to the forum (and the slippery slope of modding!), M  

What you describe sounds as if it might possibly be a fuel pump issue but only if you are remapped and have an efficient aftermarket air intake as well. I had this behaviour (but no fuel cuts) on Revo Stage 2 after fitting a Forge Twintake. An APR HPFP has solved it.

[mervman]

Thanks RedRobin!

I have the stage 2 software and a 76mm decat downpipe that it requires. No intake (yet!).
There's no hesitation when changing gear higher in the rev range (above 5K or below 2K).
It's only around 3K that it happens. Almost feels like a manual shift.

[jedi-knight83]

Not solved mine yet. Been so busy with work its slipped off my priority list.

Mine 'improved' after a new N75 valve and fuel filter... might have been psychological though as its still pretty noticeable at times.

[jedi-knight83]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

[rich83]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Just to recap... is this in ALL DSG modes, even Manual? Or does it only happen in D (Drive) ?

[Saintsteve]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Is this map removeable?

[jedi-knight83]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Just to recap... is this in ALL DSG modes, even Manual? Or does it only happen in D (Drive) ?

well 'D' changes too early to really notice it. Its only when your foot to the floor and changing gear that you feel it pause for half a second. Sometimes its more noticeable than other times but I mainly feel it in manual mode. I never really use 'S' but I've tested it and it also does it in 'S'

[Saintsteve]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Is this map removeable?

Have you asked VW for a stock map.? Not a mock version.. All this will be down to the map.

Have you tried DSG clutch reset in VCDS?

[jedi-knight83]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Is this map removeable?

Yes. He took a copy of my standard map before remapping so he can flash that back on and infact has done and then we have tried 3 or 4 different maps with less boost etc.

With OEM boost you cant notice it. With the boost level of the remap its very noticeable to me.

[jedi-knight83]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Is this map removeable?

Have you asked VW for a stock map.? Not a mock version.. All this will be down to the map.

Have you tried DSG clutch reset in VCDS?

I didnt know I could ask VW for a stock map?

I also feel it may well be something to do with the fact it was originally revo mapped and they then put their version of OEM back on it.

But then before mapping, Motech took that off and put on a file they said was a proper VW OEM map... and then they remapped the car.

No I havent tried a DSG clutch reset either.

[Saintsteve]

So my car is still 'hesitating' for .5 of a second before it comes back on boost after a DSG gear change.

Motech are sure its not the map.

I've changed sparks, DV, N75, Fuel filter. Also had the car checked for boost leaks.

Kind of at a dead end now of what to look for next!?

Is this map removeable?

Have you asked VW for a stock map.? Not a mock version.. All this will be down to the map.

Have you tried DSG clutch reset in VCDS?

I didnt know I could ask VW for a stock map?

I also feel it may well be something to do with the fact it was originally revo mapped and they then put their version of OEM back on it.

But then before mapping, Motech took that off and put on a file they said was a proper VW OEM map... and then they remapped the car.

No I havent tried a DSG clutch reset either.

your dealer will be able to flash a genuine map on it. it will give you a fresh base to check the car before putting a  remap back on.

[heavyd]

The dealers around where I live had no idea how to put a full vwstock map on my car.
If it was a full revo stock flash, it will have been ok.
Why dont you get someone to do a vcds scan and log the torque limiter block to see if the DSG is interfering?

[jedi-knight83]

The dealers around where I live had no idea how to put a full vwstock map on my car.
If it was a full revo stock flash, it will have been ok.
Why dont you get someone to do a vcds scan and log the torque limiter block to see if the DSG is interfering?

I can borrow the vagcom cable for a while and log it myself if someone can be kind enough to tell me what to check :)

I can also try this dsg clutch reset too if its easy enough.

Motech said that revo dont put the proper OEM map on the car... just their version of what they think OEM should be... hence why he flashed a new OEM map on the car first...