Advice on best catch can

[Statller-Stevo]

Yes it is debateable as I can't remember now (VrsAlex?) recently took a head apart that had had a catchcan fitted and the valves were completely covered in carbon as if it had never had one on.

I personally can't see the difference between a catchcan and the pcv revamp or even PCV as the oil and gunk just drains back into the engine.

Does the PCV not just use the vacuum from the engine intake to pull more out?

I am lead to believe that the only effective method of stopping the head and valves carbonising is WMI.

 

Nail on theee head!
A catch can will NOT stop the inlet valves getting sh*tty at all, although it will reduce it
By their very nature the only thing to stop DFI'S gunking up is WMI, nitrous or extra injectors in the inlet manifold say on a  BT car
My demo cars inlet valves are like new (direct port WMI)
All the new DFI Porsches are the same! all gunky in the inlet chambers, other manufactures cars too
I use the BSH PCV blank on the Loba car but it's not ideal, it's ok for reliability reasons but the concern for me is blow back

Stevo why are they more important on a race car?

Are we safely saying no point on a road car?

Even with a remap?

WMI for me soon. It seems like a very logical solution to several key issues.

Al, save your money and get WMI or if you still want one get the forge.

I had  BSH and it was/is sh*t as its designed for cars without the charcoal thingy.

A catch can is essential for prolonged high boost set ups, its all down to blow back to the crankcase
The more boost you make the more an engine will leak it naturally, the blank is not ideal for this reason but it's a good quick fix.

[RedRobin]

A catch can will NOT stop the inlet valves getting sh*tty at all, although it will reduce it

....Reducing the gunkiness makes it worthwhile as far as I'm concerned. I don't run particularly high boost on Revo 2 (K03) but I do use the revs and hence boost quite often - It's just a style of driving because I don't like relying on low down torque to get going. Personally I don't fancy the inconvenience of running WMI and compromising load space but I can appreciate it has benefits.

[GrayMK5GTI]

Giving it some thought, all engines (not just the TFSI) will be making this gunk (especially during the winter) and it's not causing any harm to any of the others, bearing in mind the outlay of £300+ for this set up, you could get an oil change (if you really wanted) every winter for the rest of the cars life. . .   

I personally need more convincing that the gunk is particularly harmful (it's like a bit of mayo round the oil cap after lots of short trips), the engine will burn it off after a long run.

My old focus ST got loads of gunk round the oil cap in the winter but would burn it away on a decent run.  It's just oil emulsifying from bits of water vapour in it. When I asked Ford the said its normal on some turbo cars, and will have been considered during the design of the engine.

Gray

[h4rdy]

Giving it some thought, all engines (not just the TFSI) will be making this gunk (especially during the winter) and it's not causing any harm to any of the others, bearing in mind the outlay of £300+ for this set up, you could get an oil change (if you really wanted) every winter for the rest of the cars life. . .   

I personally need more convincing that the gunk is particularly harmful (it's like a bit of mayo round the oil cap after lots of short trips), the engine will burn it off after a long run.

My old focus ST got loads of gunk round the oil cap in the winter but would burn it away on a decent run.  It's just oil emulsifying from bits of water vapour in it. When I asked Ford the said its normal on some turbo cars, and will have been considered during the design of the engine.

Gray

I think nail on the head time again.

Snake oil on a road car.

[Statller-Stevo]

Giving it some thought, all engines (not just the TFSI) will be making this gunk (especially during the winter) and it's not causing any harm to any of the others, bearing in mind the outlay of £300+ for this set up, you could get an oil change (if you really wanted) every winter for the rest of the cars life. . .   

I personally need more convincing that the gunk is particularly harmful (it's like a bit of mayo round the oil cap after lots of short trips), the engine will burn it off after a long run.

My old focus ST got loads of gunk round the oil cap in the winter but would burn it away on a decent run.  It's just oil emulsifying from bits of water vapour in it. When I asked Ford the said its normal on some turbo cars, and will have been considered during the design of the engine.

Gray

It's off the original topic this but You need to have a good knowledge of DFI'S to understand what I mean, forget the old oil filler cap thing!
(I really don't mean that condescendingly by the way I'm just trying to explain)
On the 04- VW gti's The fuel is not injected through the inlet valves like on your Old ST was
It's massively different in design
Although the brand new focus's are DfI's & they will get sh*tted up like our VW's I guarantee it!
I had an 07 40k mile 997 GT3 stripped last week and the inlet valves were as new ( engine tired though) I also stripped Doms Ed 30 at the same time, after a recent poor rebuild & clean he had carried out,  the DFi golf's inlet valves were badly sh*tted up again after only a few thousand miles! The GT3's were as new but it had led a very hard track life!
Frequent Oil changes etc will not stop this nor catch cans they will help but never stop it
Turn the DFi into a normal efi and it will stop it!! but then the magic is lost !
It's the lesser of all evil, DFi = massive leap in the petrol engine power envelope + economy

[GrayMK5GTI]

Hi Stevo,

My comment was relating to the emulsifying of the oil and the gunk that forms in the engine (and the benefit of catch cans collecting this gunk), rather than the oil touching the inlet valves. Direct injection seems to be the way forward and most manufacturers are using it to meet economy and emissions targets. This will obviously be a common problem in future.

I suppose VW /Audi considered this when they took the decision to use DFI, must be a bit embarrassing to have your Audi R8 coming into Audi with the valves covered in oil.

Although if you look at the back of Castrol Edge oil packaging it says it's formulated to help keep FSI valves clean 

[Statller-Stevo]

I suppose VW /Audi considered this when they took the decision to use DFI, must be a bit embarrassing to have your Audi R8 coming into Audi with the valves covered in oil.

Too right the NA cars are very very bad, the Castrol low ash oils don't help much I'm afraid (as we know now)
I think this is why we see so many RS4 & R8's dyno so low as they can't fill their lungs as was intended at the top end.
Lots of tuning shops are pulling the heads of these now to clean then rebuild, they make the power after but indeed will sh*t up again
The turbo cars don't get affected so bad as the intake air is compressed 

[vRSAlex]

It was the vRS that I had stripped and cleaned the head on when I fitted the rods.  Around 2k later I removed the inlet mani to fit a new injector and the valves were getting gunked up again.  I have the forge catch can fitted.

Using the Eurojet rocker cover which blanks off the front and rear pcv's will help more than just blanking the front, but you will always get build up as there is nothing to clean the ports on the direct fuel injection cars.

Wmi is going on the vRS soon for power reasons rather than to clean the ports, but having the ports cleaned for me is a bonus.

[Tfsi_Mike]

It was the vRS that I had stripped and cleaned the head on when I fitted the rods.  Around 2k later I removed the inlet mani to fit a new injector and the valves were getting gunked up again.  I have the forge catch can fitted.

Using the Eurojet rocker cover which blanks off the front and rear pcv's will help more than just blanking the front, but you will always get build up as there is nothing to clean the ports on the direct fuel injection cars.

Wmi is going on the vRS soon for power reasons rather than to clean the ports, but having the ports cleaned for me is a bonus.

 

[vRSAlex]

It was the vRS that I had stripped and cleaned the head on when I fitted the rods.  Around 2k later I removed the inlet mani to fit a new injector and the valves were getting gunked up again.  I have the forge catch can fitted.

Using the Eurojet rocker cover which blanks off the front and rear pcv's will help more than just blanking the front, but you will always get build up as there is nothing to clean the ports on the direct fuel injection cars.

Wmi is going on the vRS soon for power reasons rather than to clean the ports, but having the ports cleaned for me is a bonus.

 

I won't let you buy one as they are bloody expensive.  I'm trying to get INA to start making a better version that cheaper too.

[Tfsi_Mike]

Do INA only do 1.8 ones atm?

[Statller-Stevo]

It was the vRS that I had stripped and cleaned the head on when I fitted the rods.  Around 2k later I removed the inlet mani to fit a new injector and the valves were getting gunked up again.  I have the forge catch can fitted.

Using the Eurojet rocker cover which blanks off the front and rear pcv's will help more than just blanking the front, but you will always get build up as there is nothing to clean the ports on the direct fuel injection cars.

Wmi is going on the vRS soon for power reasons rather than to clean the ports, but having the ports cleaned for me is a bonus.

We never intended to use the meth to clean the ports its just a by product that happened
The rear breather can be vented to atmosphere if you really want to, we're doing that next week on the Loba car instead of carving up an intake Revo has loaned us. Well see how it runs under heavy boost like that
I suppose if our car lived at high boost / RPM conditions all the time then we would use a custom catch can of our own design
It's not needed yet, but will be on the next phase of cars were working on now

[RedRobin]

.
Well, here's hoping that by having a Forge catchcan installed, no harm is being done and perhaps a little bit of gunk etc REDUCTION is a good thing.

Perhaps if I'd known all this before I got my catchcan I might not have bothered, But my excuse is that at the time of the Groupo Buy on the BSH catchcan it was the 'flavour of the month' amongst forumites and I went with the flow. I didn't like the BSH and so swopped to a Forge and here I am, collecting gunk and fluid on a regular basis.