Whos got a hybrid??

[vRSAlex]

Stock K04 injectors will run to 400 bhp ok as seen on quite a few revo race maps.

I'm currently running a hybrid.  Hits 1.8 bar peak all day long tailing off to 1.5 at 7250.  Drives just how I wanted it to.  Boost comes in smoothly to help with spin.

I'm just using the revo race file with hybrid.  Not aware of a specific 2+ file for a hybrid.

Fitted a few of the usp intank kits with the fake chinese walbro pumps.  The whole kits looks like it was made at a nursery.

So is the rs3 intank pump better than the stock fsi pump Steve?  Don't want to use the usp tat.  Would prefer to use a Bosch 044 in the custom baskets I've made before on race cars, but its not ideal on a road car.

[jon-tfsi]

Have you still not been on a Dyno yet Alex?

What boost would a std K04 hold at 7000rpm?

[vRSAlex]

Have you still not been on a Dyno yet Alex?

What boost would a std K04 hold at 7000rpm?

Around 1.3 - 1.4 bar.  Need to remember that it might not seem like the hybrid holds much more boost, bit the comp wheel flows more air too at the same boost levels.

Still not been on the dyno.  Just need to get over to APR when I have a spare evening.

[Statller-Stevo]

We don't use anything USP Ive never seen anything from them so can't comment, we order the pumps in direct from the US and mod the cradle to suite, flows 50% more than stock at the same voltage / amps when we tested ourselves
only just fitted the RS3 pump on Saturday so got loads of testing to do were using the twin pick up pipes too
In late 2009 when we first used the TD hybrids we immediatly noticed the mid range was lacking and coming in later.
We had two Ed 30 demo's back then and the stock turbo car we ran physically out paced the hybrid car so the way we had to tune the car to compensate maxed out the stock injectors  & in my opinion left very little room for any kind of safety intervention from the ECU, if your maxing the fueling already then factory safety is out the window, our car felt much more settled with better fueling, I ran 2.2 bar holding 1.5 to 6600rpms at International 2010 with a GIAC race file and stayed with Hurdy right to 140mph when he ran WON nitrous (beat all his times too if you ask him, He ran 450hp & 510ftlbs on a DD roller set with the WON kit)  so our car was fast back then 12.7 @ Inters sh*te surface in a fully built car two up hasn't been beaten yet even by the stripped out cars running just one seat & no trim
The problem were now having with the loba compared to anything else I've tested is the high torque at high RPM still got 414ft lbs @ 6400 rpms (the old hybrid tailed off like a bitch 300ftlbs at those revs, did peak at 420 with the meth though)
What duty cycle are you seeing in the mid with the S3 injectors AL ? Or are you on a tsi motor I think anything much above 7ms is too much myself although I've seen data logs up to 8.8 / 9.0 on some cars that run ok ish
I always felt the 390-400 hp cars were on the raggy edge of the fueling the data logs are  so much more relaxed with more  in reserve, I suppose everyone sets things up differently you'll have your ways we have ours etc
Kev @ Revo sent me the RS4 2+ injector file for my T box ecu, it's a custom flash I've not tried yet, by the way AL they are testing with the Loba now themselves on an R so Revo will offer software to support Loba

[vRSAlex]

You have to try an 044 at some point.  Won't work with the stock pump ecu but on a 3076 it was still holding 6.5 bar at 7.5k.

Is the walbro working ok with the stock pump ecu and can it run the tank down to empty ok?

Need to check my logs on the injector duty.  Can't remember off my head.  Apr fuel pump deffo helps ove the autotech imo.  They always seem to sustain slightly higher pressures.  Mine is an fsi.

Do you have an true egt sensor and gauge on your car Steve?  I still find it amazing that the tiny k04 hotside will flow 500 bhp without getting too hot, even with the top part of the runners being opened out.

You say twin pickup, do you mean you are running the suction jet pickup that keeps the basket filled?

[Statller-Stevo]

You have to try an 044 at some point.  Won't work with the stock pump ecu but on a 3076 it was still holding 6.5 bar at 7.5k.

Is the walbro working ok with the stock pump ecu and can it run the tank down to empty ok?

Need to check my logs on the injector duty.  Can't remember off my head.  Apr fuel pump deffo helps ove the autotech imo.  They always seem to sustain slightly higher pressures.  Mine is an fsi.

Do you have an true egt sensor and gauge on your car Steve?  I still find it amazing that the tiny k04 hotside will flow 500 bhp without getting too hot, even with the top part of the runners being opened out.

You say twin pickup, do you mean you are running the suction jet pickup that keeps the basket filled?

The cars maxed out AL IMO it's not safe to run the stock motor like that for long your asking for trouble it was just an excersise to see the absolute limits of everything as were using this car to test for the next project were building
Loba's trying to find a good cost effective solution for better headers right now for different set ups, they are already designed in CAD from what I've heard I guess that's the next stage for them, I think then it will be limitless power wise whatever you want etc that's what we hope to use on the RS motor
The Walbro works fine with the pump ecu it's been good for nearly 3 years now no problems at all, Infact the whole motors been good no major problems with anything really, EGT's are between 900-990 at high load so easily within safe specs still although we know the meth helps out to keep them down, (intakes 35-38 degs) the problem now is high load high gear fuel shortage at high rpm (this problem is at the 500hp level no problems when turned down to 450-460)
Were are still running the Auto-tech but Simon is sending us one of their rail pumps to test on this app after the holiday
How do the Bosch pumps work regards the return less set up ? Or is it an 8 injector set up ?
I know a few are using the V10 RS6 lifts now, I've not seen one yet, I might order one in to take a look

[vRSAlex]

You measuring the egts with a standalone sensor and gauge?  The med9 only has projected temps.

I've got three walbros in stock, but I would rather run an oem style pump that fits perfectly.  The 044 just runs constant pressure as its full 12v.  The return system never had any issues.  Similar setup is used on Adrian Autosoft's S3 with no issues too.  Only thing I can see is it putting more strain on the fuel filters return.

Fueling is perfectly fine on my car.  Trims and lambda is spot on.  Wmi will be going on soon once the larger tb turns up and I've finished fabricating my new high flow and well fitting intercooler to tb pipe.    I don't max out my car looking for numbers, but its at the higher level and safe.

If the rs4 injector file is the same as the one I've seen before then it was originally used in the US when they couldn't get hold of s3 injectors.  Does allow extra head room which is nice, but its crap on fuel economy iirc?

You saying that your car is currently maxed?  Sounds like you have one of those engines that just won't give up.  Managed to give mine a build last year with rods and headstuds.  S3 cams were added a few months back.  Ported head and full ferrea valvetrain planned for the end of the year.  Just need a cluster that revs to 8k.

Very interested to know if the rs3 or rs6 pumps are any better.  Apr don't seem to think they are and just use stock pumps on their stg4 setups I believe.

Much more than 500 then you will be looking at a different inlet and some extra injectors!

[Tfsi_Mike]

Iirc MrP's lpfp was a late revision 2.0 Tfsi one and held good pressure

[daz_pd]

@Statllers, can i just ask, have you guys done much with the 2.0 TSI engine yet?

[Statller-Stevo]

Yes I've become attached to this particular motor, she's a good en bless, uses no oil at all (maybe Hurdys was built by the same guy!  )
Ive never really tuned a high comp motor beyond K04 yet we've always stayed with the low comp K04 motors due to general superior head and block strength, I run the boost controller maxed all the time on the Loba car just to test,  we can't make our mind up if she will go quietly with a misfire or a big bang
You will have a nice little bus for sure when you've finished Alex, we were originally thinking GTX35R plus nitrous for the 4WD DSG time attack car but I really don't think well stray from the Loba now especially as they will hopefully have the headers resolved soon
The Loba is a good fast road car / occasional track turbo for sure but I think out and out the GTX's are the power monsters but the lag is incredible on that app, makes a great track car though
The 2+ RS4 file isn't a yank flash it's one they made recently for my T box, the yanks don't have that ecu for the K04 lumps and the early J & K boxes are different
You'll love the meth it makes one hell of a difference if it's fitted and jetted correctly
We tried using twin Bosch hi flows on the high horse Porsche's TT's but they always over fuelled eventually & the ampage demand was crazy at idle, good for power though say if you were building a standing mile car, when the 997 TT's came out the fueling was massively advanced from the factory.(now gives me an idea for the walbros )
We're finishing tuning the 997 T in the next few weeks I can't wait will make the Golf look like a 1.0 lupo
(over 800 ftlbs @ 3500rpm  )
I don't use a stand alone EGT on the car as its not run at Wot in 6th constantly at this power, if we ever considered doing that  then I'd use our AFR data logger and fit it permanent .
 The car never drops into saftey at the 450 mark though, I get many 2+ cars in that are straight into safety with three dyno runs power drops 20hp each run. Same cooling I use on my car on the dyno, still need even more cooling though must say.
When I fit the walbros they look o.e I even fit it into the three leg brace with a tiny piece of rubber wrapped around for a good fit
All the best with your build AL will certainly rase a few eyebrows

Anyway I think we stole this chaps original thread so do apologise 

[Statller-Stevo]

@Statllers, can i just ask, have you guys done much with the 2.0 TSI engine yet?

Nothing past K04 yet, looks promising though, low comp & lots of fuel etc
Don't know about internal strengths though

[vRSAlex]

I'm sure he won't mind us straying a little bit.  All good info, even if we are giving loads away!

The 044 is a pig to get fitted into the original basket.  Just the outer and lid left.  I will try and find some pics.  Had to squeeze it all into a xbow fuel tank.  This xbow wasn't particularly laggy even with the gt3076 with the .80 housing and lower than normal comp pistons. 2 bar peak at just under 4k and held just under that to the limiter.  Really easy to drive round the lag too.  This was on a bwa I built too.   l did read that the k04 heads are made of a slightly different alloy that can cope with higher heat, but nothing confirms that.  Blocks just have more ribbing around the mains.  The less strong 1.8t engine copes ok with big numbers.

An hta/gtx3071 should spool as fast as a hybrid k04 but flow as well if not better than the loba.    Should cope with far more abuse too with metal caged bearings etc.  Turbo will push an easy 500bhp at moderate boost.

Twin 044's on a race car or drag works ok, but as you say, they are no good in traffic.

I wish I had never sold my VEM's wideband and egt gauge from the ibiza.  Would be nice to always see what's going on.

Looking forward to getting the wmi on the vRS.  Racelogic traction control is also waiting to go on if I ever get time.  Need to book a week's slot just get everything done tbh.

[dan930]

I'm still intreasted in the turbo dynamics hybrid,how much are rs4 injectors & uprated fuel rail??& where is the cheapest place to buy it??

[dan930]

Lpfp is about £200-250. Cheaper if you Uprated the internals of the existing pump.

Mike, I didn't have a hybrid on mine, but Steve and Craig did and I saw most of the fitting and development they went through when running them. That's the benefit of living less than 4 miles away from a good tuning place. 

I can post up a Dyno graph of my old T-dynamics hybrid if anyone's interested, just bear in mind I still ran an Autotech rail + RS4 injectors and a walbro Lift pump to support the power, we ran over 400hp and more again when we fitted WMI.
All this was done and dusted over 2 years ago.
Revo have a 2+ file to support the fueling with this turbo now, I used a GIAC custom back then
You'll run out of fuel with stock injectors if you want more than 2+ power, if you try to tune the hybrid with the stock injectors and keep it safe it's not worth bothering with unless your only after 10-20 hp more but you'll not feel it at all.

Hi Steve,so does that mean I can pop into any revo dealer to get software to run this turbo dynamics md507 ko4 hybrid??

[DaveB@Vagbremtechnic]

It's a little known fact that LOBA also sell a lot of tuning bits other than turbos, so speak to a LOBA dealer who'll get you prices injectors only.....that said they don't sell a lot of stuff over here due to shipping probably...

Worth asking the question though