achieving more front camber

[Janner_Sy]

i have been tracking my car alot around the nurburgring (a bonus of the government posting me an hour from nurburg )
and have started this obsessed quest to go faster through the bends.

so far i have got coilovers had them cornerweighted, i have eibach front and Rear ARBs(rear set to stiff, front set to soft),and the walk, but i want more turn in.

i dont want to go for stiffer ARBs as i dont want to ruin the wet weather handling by having to stiff a car, plus i use this car every day.
im looking at poly bushes all around, but ideally i want more negative camber on the car, i see there are a few options,

power grip front wishbones
audi TT lower support arms
but are there any other options.

is there anyone on here with more additional negative front camber. who can advise on it

cheers guys

sy

[jonnyc]

i have been tracking my car alot around the nurburgring (a bonus of the government posting me an hour from nurburg )
and have started this obsessed quest to go faster through the bends.

so far i have got coilovers had them cornerweighted, i have eibach front and Rear ARBs(rear set to stiff, front set to soft),and the walk, but i want more turn in.

i dont want to go for stiffer ARBs as i dont want to ruin the wet weather handling by having to stiff a car, plus i use this car every day.
im looking at poly bushes all around, but ideally i want more negative camber on the car, i see there are a few options,

power grip front wishbones
audi TT lower support arms
but are there any other options.

is there anyone on here with more additional negative front camber. who can advise on it

cheers guys

sy

Power grip front wishbones are horrible, basically they achieve the front camber by cutting the standard bottom arm, extend it by welding some more in, and then paint it all up.. terrible!

The TT arms are a better way of doing it, but about £800 all in and you can only get a maximum of 0.5 degrees..

Top mounts are the way to go.. I have a set for sale.. If your interested let me know..

[Janner_Sy]

what is the standard camber the mk 5 is set to.

£800 thats alot more than i thought. I can howver get all this tax free and with further discounts so its not too much of an issue. you have yours combined with WALK, how do you find that.

the morego gives you an additonal 1.75degree Negative camber, and gots good reviews on the evo road test. and at £495 not to badly priced.

I do agree that top mounts are probably the best way of doing it. what top mounts have you got, what do they adjust...Camber , Caster, or both, what make, and how much.

Also how come you are not using them?

thanks jonny
Sy

[jonnyc]

what is the standard camber the mk 5 is set to.

£800 thats alot more than i thought. I can howver get all this tax free and with further discounts so its not too much of an issue. you have yours combined with WALK, how do you find that.

the morego gives you an additonal 1.75degree Negative camber, and gots good reviews on the evo road test. and at £495 not to badly priced.

I do agree that top mounts are probably the best way of doing it. what top mounts have you got, what do they adjust...Camber , Caster, or both, what make, and how much.

Also how come you are not using them?

thanks jonny
Sy

I have a set of AST top mounts that are fixed to 2 degrees negative..

The KW top mounts that I have can go upto 3.5 degrees when in camber adjustment and 2.2 degrees when rotated to maximize caster..

[jon-tfsi]

There is a thread over on audisport.net titled "fitted TT suspension arms to A3"

This has some usefull information regarding negative camber.
This suggests the price of the tt arms is more like £350
They are much lighter than the steel ones on your car which should improve handling by reducing unsprung weight. It also looks like they may give a little more than 0.5 deg extra.

Thought this might be usefull info

[Janner_Sy]

I have a set of AST top mounts that are fixed to 2 degrees negative..

The KW top mounts that I have can go upto 3.5 degrees when in camber adjustment and 2.2 degrees when rotated to maximize caster..

are the AST top mounts an additional -2 degrees camber ontop of oem spec, or -2 degrees total

are you using your KW top mounts as well as the TT lower arms

[jonnyc]

I have a set of AST top mounts that are fixed to 2 degrees negative..

The KW top mounts that I have can go upto 3.5 degrees when in camber adjustment and 2.2 degrees when rotated to maximize caster..

are the AST top mounts an additional -2 degrees camber ontop of oem spec, or -2 degrees total

are you using your KW top mounts as well as the TT lower arms

They will set the suspension at -2 degrees.. Standard the car runs about 0.8 degrees..

Nope, just the top mounts..

[Janner_Sy]

what is the condition of the AST top mounts. Also do you have any links of reviews on them as i cant track them down on google. I am however interested in them

[Janner_Sy]

what is the best way to set your car up for track and road with reference to camber and castor. ive heard some people say you need more camber and others say that more castor is what you need.

i on the other hand am not sure, and would love to have some info to back me up when i get it all setup at a garage

[pazz]

what is the best way to set your car up for track and road with reference to camber and castor. ive heard some people say you need more camber and others say that more castor is what you need.

i on the other hand am not sure, and would love to have some info to back me up when i get it all setup at a garage

Car geometry is complicated. By adjusting camber you are also changing toe and castor (to less of an amount).

I once regretted going down the route of having a fully adjustable suspension setup on a Skyline (coilovers, adjustable control arms all round), purely because I struggled to find a local-ish garage which had the equipment and knowledge to set it up correctly.

However if you near to these guys http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/ your in luck as they are the nutz at full geo setups.

[pazz]

More is not necessarily better.

I am no expert by any means....

But from what I remember of trying to setup my last car (yes I wasted a huge amount of money trying to get it right) increased negative camber leads to better turn-in, however there is an optimum before you have so little actual tyre on the road that grip is lost.

Take for example this setup. Nowadays its done for the look, but the jap's were cambering all their RWD monsters in, to allow easy tyre breakaway - allowing on/off controllable drifting.



Aggressive negative camber results in an uneven load placed on the tyre; the tread width is not utilised. And you could safely say that you wasted time and money buying the width of tyre you have bought.

But yes, more negative camber gives a better turn in, but there are side-effects and downsides to going at it all-guns-blazing.

[Janner_Sy]

i understand a little about it i guess.

i know too much negative camber wil be great for cornering but it will have  detrimental effect on straight line traction as well as excessive tyre wear. both of which i dont want.

I also understand that with the additional castor provided by the Whiteline anti lift kit, you develop dynamic castor upon turning.
So my point is, should i increase the castor on the front to give even more dynamic negative camber. thus keeping straight line traction high, and tyre wear at a minimum or should i adjust to say -2 degrees camber  on the front combined with the WALK.

another thing i understand that if i have much more grip on the front i will run the risk of out grippping my rear and having oversteer occur, so i would surely need a little additional camber on the rear to cancel that out, and induce rear wheel steer.

please correct me if i am wrong. these are all things that i have picked up and tried to get my head around

[pazz]

Do you know what your running currently?

I cant really help you to be honest, I've no past experience of FWD suspension geo setups.

[Janner_Sy]

im running the standard setup as far as  i know. i havent had the geometry changed. just the coilovers lowering etc.

[pazz]

im running the standard setup as far as  i know. i havent had the geometry changed. just the coilovers lowering etc.

This will of changed the geo from stock - in some cars, quite considerably.

You will already be running more negative camber all-round than a stock car. I was about to draw you a diagram, but its 11:00pm