Make a donation

Author Topic: better traction  (Read 2959 times)

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
better traction
« on: March 14, 2013, 09:20:27 pm »
Track Width..
To measure am i right in thinking its from outside of each tire and front\rear should both be the same or front wider?

Wider front = less under steer more over steer
Wider rear = more under steer less over steer


Tire Pressure.
Should the front be lower or higher than rear?

Other suggestions welcome..
I have swaybars soft front\harder rear
SuperPro front bushes
« Last Edit: May 21, 2016, 09:39:27 pm by SteveS »

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline karl210

  • Always Involved
  • ****
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 2
  • -Receive: 6
  • Posts: 258
    • Email
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2013, 09:28:58 pm »
youve put the same thing for the wider front / wider rear.
To be honest my car has decent tyres and eibach springs and i havent felt 1 bit of understeer compared to most cars, it grips nice with a bit of lift off oversteer, what other handling mods do you have?
Edit: just read your sig

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2013, 09:32:33 pm »
It is probably also down to my driving. But I'm just trying to rule out and think of everything

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline camfollower

  • Won't Shut up.
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 10
  • -Receive: 31
  • Posts: 556
  • Cam follower awareness.
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2013, 09:39:39 pm »
Slow in fast out

Offline karl210

  • Always Involved
  • ****
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 2
  • -Receive: 6
  • Posts: 258
    • Email
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2013, 09:42:28 pm »
have you got the same tyres all around? ive always had odd ones in the past but on my new car there all the same and its fully predictable round every corner, i damaged my rear left the other week and had to quickly get a new budget fitted and it seems to have made it a little bit more unpredictable when turning right, it really oversteers

Offline Top Cat

  • Top cat
  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 171
  • -Receive: 335
  • Posts: 8196
  • Almost Jacamo
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2013, 09:47:20 pm »
You are always going to get understeer in a front wheel drive car when you reach the limit of grip. To reduce it as much as you can you want the best tyres you can afford a decent Geo set up. If you want need to reduce it further then you want to try and get more grip on the front. wider tyres and lower tyre pressures on the front will help. Also adjustable top mounts for some camber.
As i mentioned though you cant get rid of it totally unless you have it set up silly so the back end keeps snapping out.  You should however be able to get it so you would be doing silly fast speeds on a bend ( on track ) were you feel you dont have any understeer.  :driver:

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2013, 10:03:26 pm »
Thanks topcat. By wider tires can i use spacers or are you suggesting the actual tire itself?

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline Top Cat

  • Top cat
  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 171
  • -Receive: 335
  • Posts: 8196
  • Almost Jacamo
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2013, 10:11:53 pm »
Well in theory a spacer gives it a wider track but in reality it wont have any effect at all. It has to be physical grip. by lowering the tyre pressure you are widening the contact patch a smidge which equals more grip again, in theory.
 If your car has a half decent set up you shouldn't really experience understeer on the roads unless you go around roundabouts to fast or drive at silly speeds. I would just get your geo done professionally and get some really good tyres, this should see you get rid of understeer on the road.  :happy2:

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2013, 10:39:37 pm »
Whats your suggestion of really good tires?
I will need some soon.
I really do suffer from under steer. The rear track seems wider on look than the front (hence question) and i have put in 2.6 bar all round.

Is it not worth using a tire wider than 225 either?

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline tony_danza

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 3
  • -Receive: 112
  • Posts: 3013
  • The voice of objective reason, but mine's best.
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2013, 10:41:21 pm »
Define your understeer, if you can?

Entering a corner, not wanting to turn in?
Through the corner?
Exiting the corner adding power?
Sideways yo!

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2013, 10:42:10 pm »
Though and exiting i would say

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline tony_danza

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 3
  • -Receive: 112
  • Posts: 3013
  • The voice of objective reason, but mine's best.
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2013, 10:44:38 pm »
As you apply power, do you tend to steer more into the corner to counter the front washing wide?
Sideways yo!

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2013, 10:45:56 pm »
probably sometimes.. i guess naturally i would have

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats

Offline tony_danza

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 3
  • -Receive: 112
  • Posts: 3013
  • The voice of objective reason, but mine's best.
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2013, 10:58:04 pm »
As you do that, you reduce the contact patch, reducing grip..  and because you have an LSD, it power-understeers washing the front wide.

38PSI is too high. Try 34F 36R.
Geo maybe wants looking at, is it 'stock'?
What tyres do you have? a 225 is pretty small for all that power, they need to be grippy.

I think this is a combination of your style and possibly one or more of the above. I can't really tell you how to drive, but try this:

Enter a corner so that you turn in as you brake/lift, getting the weight to transfer to the front and increase grip. As you aim for the apex, gently start to trail the gas, you'll feel the diff hook up and pull you tighter to the line. Use this trailing power to drive you through the bend, only adding more gas as you wind the lock off and exit.
Sideways yo!

Offline SteveS

  • Just look at my post count
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Given: 14
  • -Receive: 10
  • Posts: 1300
Re: Understeer Questions
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2013, 11:03:16 pm »
Thanks a lot.

Lower front psi always make the tires look flat, but ill give it a shot.

Geo is stock i guess, only the superpro bushes in there..

Front Goodyear assy 1
rear Michelin ps2
I had the same issue with the Michelin's all round though

I assume i have to replace the wheels to increase the tire width :\ costly!

SOLD!! :(
VW GTI Edition 30 No. 0551
Revo Stage2+ (LT) | Evoms Intake, K&N Filter | VWR LSD | Milltek R32 TBE | VWR Engine Mounts | VWR Big Front & S3 Rear Brakes | VWR Springs |  VWR Shortshift | SuperPro Bushes |  Recaro Seats