BSH Engine Mounts Review Update 2/12/09 page 3

[Top Cat]

From what i can tell these mounts are to better transfer the power down onto the road through the drive train.

I feel both the BSH and VWR will  be very capable of doing this.

....


Regarding cost differences I reckon it's because on one hand, BSH manufacture their own in-house (correct me if I'm wrong) and have probably also cut their profits because they seem very keen to sell quantity and establish themselves. VWR on the other hand, have their mounts manufactured outside. How do VF prices compare?

I agree with you here Robin  completely, and if they both reduce engine movement which is the reason  for fitting these, then unfortunately  BSH have managed to price VWR out of the market completely.

BSH = £ 180

VWR = £ 470 approx

If they both perform to a similar level then that is one hell of a hike in price to pay for a GRRRRrrrr .

And i know cost is not a concern to you Robin, but that is a no-brainer whoever you may be.  

[RedRobin]

^^^^
That's absolutely right, TC. So far, I can't see how the BSH mounts won't perform every bit as well as the VWR mounts and they cost much, much less - Good for the consumer but not so good for VWR.

Thing is, that even as what you call a no-brainer, there are loads of people like me who will pay approx £300 extra for the Grrrrrrrr!! It's no different than what some people spend on the differences in car sound systems.

As it happens, I was only talking this weekend to a friend interested in engine mounts for his car and who loves the sound of mine. I told him that my VWR cost substantially more money than the BSH and his reply was "Robin, you know me, if I like something I don't care if it's expensive" (or words to that effect).  

[QD MBE]

^^^^
That's absolutely right, TC. So far, I can't see how the BSH mounts won't perform every bit as well as the VWR mounts and they cost much, much less - Good for the consumer but not so good for VWR.

Thing is, that even as what you call a no-brainer, there are loads of people like me who will pay approx £300 extra for the Grrrrrrrr!! It's no different than what some people spend on the differences in car sound systems.

As it happens, I was only talking this weekend to a friend interested in engine mounts for his car and who loves the sound of mine. I told him that my VWR cost substantially more money than the BSH and his reply was "Robin, you know me, if I like something I don't care if it's expensive" (or words to that effect).  

The BSH look far more expensive than the VWR as well.  They look better finished, the anodised black looks very classy.  The VWR seems to be made up from a kit of parts.  it would not surprise me if the VW Racing versions are a generic mount, adapted for use in the Golf.

[john_o]

to be fair TC I reckon you could get the VWR mounts for less than £470 , but still its more than double the BSH ones.
the VF alternative 2 side mounts are £300 from JKM   http://www.jkm.org.uk/performance/tfsimotormounts.htm#tfsi

In design the VF/BSH look virtually identical, with central rubber 'cores'
the big thing about  the VWR ones is that they appear to have far less rubber in their construction. but we would need one 'taken apart' to view its internals just to see actually how much rubber there is in there and how the surfaces are used to transmit forces.
like Robin says I would like to compare durometer rating for VF and BSH.
I reckon youre right about the 'generic' bit stokeballon as if it was the only mount you'd certainly have removed any excessive metal.
unless the huge black bar performs some function (?)

[RobH]

I don't think you'll hear any extra sounds with only the lower mount fitted - That's definitely how it is with the VWR mounts. But it's the lower mount which kills the vast majority of the engine rocking and delivers the power more directly.

You are aware im talking about the solid race mount not the fast road mounts that vwracing do right.

Herd it in Mat ed30 car and sounded mean, dont know if that was the blueflame tbe playing mind games and im pretty sure he only has the lower on fitted aswell.

Anyway aslong as it improves power delivery to the road and stops engine rocking im happy, the Grrrr is a bonus .

[RedRobin]

I don't think you'll hear any extra sounds with only the lower mount fitted - That's definitely how it is with the VWR mounts. But it's the lower mount which kills the vast majority of the engine rocking and delivers the power more directly.

You are aware im talking about the solid race mount not the fast road mounts that vwracing do right.

Herd it in Mat ed30 car and sounded mean, dont know if that was the blueflame tbe playing mind games and im pretty sure he only has the lower on fitted aswell.

Anyway aslong as it improves power delivery to the road and stops engine rocking im happy, the Grrrr is a bonus .

....I've driven one of VWR's track cars with solid mounts but there was so much glorious noise going on that I just enjoyed it a whole and didn't focus on exactly what each noise was. Otherwise, I haven't heard their solid race mounts yet.

Any Grrrr is definitely heard because of engine mounts and most definitely NOT the exhaust. At first, on the VWR demo car aka Red Temptress, I thought it was exhaust too but that's only because you hear it in direct harmony as the throttle widens open.

Any Grrrr is a bonus, though not for everyone, and mine has remained the same since day1 and not lessened 

We'll have to wait and see if the BSH behave differently or not in this respect. As they appear so similar to the VF I would expect the same behaviour.

[GTIjames]

I have had the VF mounts on for almost a year now they were the only choice at the time as the BSH and VWR were not yet available but been very happy with them.

I can confirm what Robin says re the Grrr sound, it makes the car sound a lot more purposeful and I like it

Though there is alot more to these mounts than just increased cabin noise - they have pretty much eliminated wheel hop and less engine movement also means less body roll which in turn improves handling, acceleration, breaking and gear changes.

the side effects are increased cabin noise and a bit more feedback through the steering wheel and pedals - for me this is not a negative for some it might be...

 

[justin@bsh]

Great Review!   

Great Idea on mounting the charcoal canisters as well. We have been working on a bracket to do that very same job.

By the time Ben gets the order placed for the group buy he is putting  together these will be sent out with everything the Euro spec cars need.

[RedRobin]

Great Idea on mounting the charcoal canisters as well. We have been working on a bracket to do that very same job.

....I'm in the process of sourcing you a Charcoal Cannister (Phil@BSH asked for one) - Do you not want one now? If not please tell me asap so people can stop their searching.

[RedRobin]

....

While you are here, Justin, perhaps you could let us know what durometer your BSH mounts use, please. And also whether you expect the mounts to 'settle' and make less Grrrr! sounds in harmony with the throttle and exhaust.

Thanks 

[Tfsi_Mike]

....

While you are here, Justin, perhaps you could let us know what durometer your BSH mounts use, please. And also whether you expect the mounts to 'settle' and make less Grrrr! sounds in harmony with the throttle and exhaust.

Thanks 

+1 pleaaase!

[Phil@BSH]

Full details are up on the site. Durometer is 78a on the side mounts, 88a pendulum mount.
http://www.bshspeedshop.com/store/product.php?productid=16996&cat=0&page=1

[Phil@BSH]

I'd still like that charcoal canister if its available 

[RedRobin]

^^^^
Thanks for the duro info, Phil  . I think we need to find out the VF duro now *. The VWR duro too perhaps, although the VF and BSH designs are far more similar.

Re the charcoal can, someone is looking and I'll let you know as soon as we find one.

* The VF site says: "Custom manufactured high durometer polyurethane" - No duro specified.

[RedRobin]

^^^^
Oh, and the 'settling' question? Will any Grrrr lessen? Or only as the bush becomes softer?