MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Modifications & Technical Area => Performance Modifications => Topic started by: gillm on January 27, 2010, 11:04:55 pm
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right then im going to be running a gt28 kit soon on my 30k axx 2.0t it has a p-fow intake , twintercooler , milltek turbo back hpfp anf rs4 injectors does anyone have any suggestions on mapping it ? i would like to go revo but they want me to run a manual boost controller ( not really keen on it) .
im thinking apr or custom code .
any help would be great .
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right then im going to be running a gt28 kit soon on my 30k axx 2.0t it has a p-fow intake , twintercooler , milltek turbo back hpfp anf rs4 injectors does anyone have any suggestions on mapping it ? i would like to go revo but they want me to run a manual boost controller ( not really keen on it) .
im thinking apr or custom code .
any help would be great .
APR wont support you, and you would be a braver man than me going with Custard code..
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gillm - I would ask DanGB which map he is running. :smiley:
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is Dan running a custom one from jabbasport, not to sure why i think he is though. have a look through his build thread, it might say
http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=175499
----edit----
in fact looking at that i think it might be APR
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is Dan running a custom one from jabbasport, not to sure why i think he is though. have a look through his build thread, it might say
http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=175499
----edit----
in fact looking at that i think it might be APR
As far as I know Dan is just running the off the shelf APR Stage 3 kit which includes mapping etc..
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going to give west tuning a bell later on today to see what they can do for me . a mate had his mini done by him with great results .
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right then im going to be running a gt28 kit soon on my 30k axx 2.0t it has a p-fow intake , twintercooler , milltek turbo back hpfp anf rs4 injectors does anyone have any suggestions on mapping it ? i would like to go revo but they want me to run a manual boost controller ( not really keen on it) .
im thinking apr or custom code .
any help would be great .
APR wont support you, and you would be a braver man than me going with Custard code..
What is the problem with Custom Code? And APR?
:happy2:
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The only reason you would need to run a manual boost controller is that we do not support that turbo as the 3071r is much more efficient!
you may get away with using a 3071r file but we've never tested it with a 2871r the potential issue being that we haven't tuned the boost control for that turbo.... I don't see the issue with running a MBC? It's not like the car needs to be butchered to fit it... if anything it's piece of mind as you know that your boost is going to be regulated correctly and with all the electronic boost controllers on the market now it can be fine tuned to suit your needs perfectly.
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i would defo run the controller and hide it in the ash tray or in the little tray at the side of the steering wheel and then just have the map from revo
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The only reason you would need to run a manual boost controller is that we do not support that turbo as the 3071r is much more efficient!
you may get away with using a 3071r file but we've never tested it with a 2871r the potential issue being that we haven't tuned the boost control for that turbo.... I don't see the issue with running a MBC? It's not like the car needs to be butchered to fit it... if anything it's piece of mind as you know that your boost is going to be regulated correctly and with all the electronic boost controllers on the market now it can be fine tuned to suit your needs perfectly.
hi mate do you work for revo ? if so then thanks for your info . any ideas on MBC'S ?
just spoke to west tuning and it does sound good . going to have to weight it all up now , oh and buy a diff !
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yes i do work for revo hence the username :wink:
any MBC really depends on how much you want to spend.... lots of people have been using the eBoost2 recently
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many thanks for coming on here and helping out . i really want to stay revo as i had it for a few years with no problems and i like the switch features . will do some research on the eboost 2
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As Carl says mate.. Electronic boost controller and Revo stage 3 map and your away! Adjustability on boost timing and fuel which you wont have with anything else, and peace of mind that your running the best map out there..
Ran it on the S3 and now the ED30 and seriously its super smooth, great MPG (not that I really care much about that) and when you want to go f*ck me its fast!
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cool think i will stay with revo after some thought . just need to get the eboost 2 now and a diff lol .
picked up the turbo kit today (cheers jon)
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cool think i will stay with revo after some thought . just need to get the eboost 2 now and a diff lol .
picked up the turbo kit today (cheers jon)
http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0029&product=FMUNOS
Thats what most of the guys in the states seem to use..
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Martin....
Just let Carl or Kev at Revo map it for you. And you know I'd never give u bad advice.
:wink:
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IM SURE YOU HAVE SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE LOL .
opps sorry caps
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cool think i will stay with revo after some thought . just need to get the eboost 2 now and a diff lol .
picked up the turbo kit today (cheers jon)
http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0029&product=FMUNOS
Thats what most of the guys in the states seem to use..
thanks for that jonny . looks a bit renault 5 gt turbo tho lol
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cool think i will stay with revo after some thought . just need to get the eboost 2 now and a diff lol .
picked up the turbo kit today (cheers jon)
http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0029&product=FMUNOS
Thats what most of the guys in the states seem to use..
thanks for that jonny . looks a bit renault 5 gt turbo tho lol
They do it in black lol..
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looks like this will do the job .
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/products/ProductDetail.asp?cls=ROAD&pcode=AETTS-0302-2001
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http://www.apexi-usa.com/products/?id=5356
I've used this MBC, really nice bit of kit.... expensive but worth it if you're serious about getting the most from the car as can be tuned to suit the gear you're in and much more! one of those ones that you've never really finished fiddling with :)
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can i get the reasoning on manual boost controller on tfsi ?
are you not going to custom tune to his turbo ?
are you seriously just going to run gt3071 maps on his car and then lower boost through an external controller ?
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can i get the reasoning on manual boost controller on tfsi ?
are you not going to custom tune to his turbo ?
are you seriously just going to run gt3071 maps on his car and then lower boost through an external controller ?
im sure Revo have a GT28 file anyway (its a rather common turbo on the 2.0TFSI these days)
gillm just wants a MBC to flaff about with :P (he gets bored easily) :signLOL:
EDIT: or maybe not lol (just read his other thread )
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can i get the reasoning on manual boost controller on tfsi ?
are you not going to custom tune to his turbo ?
are you seriously just going to run gt3071 maps on his car and then lower boost through an external controller ?
im sure Revo have a GT28 file anyway (its a rather common turbo on the 2.0TFSI these days)
gillm just wants a MBC to flaff about with :P (he gets bored easily) :signLOL:
EDIT: or maybe not lol (just read his other thread )
no ,
if you read his post in the Revo forum , they have suggested it.
also , i have not heard of a 2871 revo car.
especially an 0.85 A/R one.
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be interesting to hear what revo have to say on the matter
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The only reason you would need to run a manual boost controller is that we do not support that turbo as the 3071r is much more efficient!
there's your reason ;-)
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The only reason you would need to run a manual boost controller is that we do not support that turbo as the 3071r is much more efficient!
there's your reason ;-)
that's a no no in my book.
get someone to custom tune your turbo.
i am not sure on who's doing what in the UK , but UNI offer custom tunes and had some success in the US.
if you change some of your specs you might get APR to give you their software. and since i presume you are reffering to HURDY's kit , if i am not mistaken he is using an 0.86 A/R which is the same as APR's kit.
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No that's a valid reason.... we will not tune something that we do not deem efficient! We will not deceive customers.... the GT2871rs is marginally bigger than a K04..... so why use it, the 3071r is a brilliant upgrade! It spools at the same point as a 2871 but keeps making power long after the 28!
Why fit anything else?!
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Carl ,
i understand your point although i do not fully agree (see apr stage III and IV) but each company is entitled to its own opinion.
but if you don't offer a tune for the GT2871 than why do you suggest it to the client (GILIM) . it is obvious that this will not be an optimized tune and will not extract the potential power of the 2871 and might event cause EGT and AFR problems.
i think its better to respond like you did now and say - "We don't offer a tune" than to offer some hybrid that's obviously prone to fail.
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Carl ,
i understand your point although i do not fully agree (see apr stage III and IV) but each company is entitled to its own opinion.
but if you don't offer a tune for the GT2871 than why do you suggest it to the client (GILIM) . it is obvious that this will not be an optimized tune and will not extract the potential power of the 2871 and might event cause EGT and AFR problems.
i think its better to respond like you did now and say - "We don't offer a tune" than to offer some hybrid that's obviously prone to fail.
:indifferent:
Have you been in an APR stage III car?? Seriously, there not as impressive as they look on the 'videos'
If Revo say that they would supply a map and control the boost with a manual controller and feel that is a valid option (which I see absolutely no reason why not) then they must be 100% sure it is.. Why bother if not? Remember, Revo have the option of supplying the Stage 4 file to who they want..
GillM.. Go with Revo, or take a punt with someone else, as thats all it will be.. You will end up back with Revo wishing thats what you did first time round.. Your more than welcome to have a passenger ride out with me in mine and ill demonstrate just how smooth and efficiently the Revo Stage 4 map is!
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jonny,
that sounds a little like advertising :)
i have driven a stage III apr car, and it was really nice. not a 600hp beast , but really linear and powerfull which is what suits a FWD if you want it to be a track car and not a drag car.
as for your case, afaik you are working directly with REVO and they custom tune your car , that is really different. REVO are very capable and can do good stuff , but they have to want to do it.
they clearly said that they do not tune for GILIM's turbo and have no intention to. so he will have to try and adjust a tune not made for his car by using a MBC.
it something that works great on the 1.8t's but i'm not really sure he will pull it through on the TFSI.
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jonny,
that sounds a little like advertising :)
i have driven a stage III apr car, and it was really nice. not a 600hp beast , but really linear and powerfull which is what suits a FWD if you want it to be a track car and not a drag car.
as for your case, afaik you are working directly with REVO and they custom tune your car , that is really different. REVO are very capable and can do good stuff , but they have to want to do it.
they clearly said that they do not tune for GILIM's turbo and have no intention to. so he will have to try and adjust a tune not made for his car by using a MBC.
it something that works great on the 1.8t's but i'm not really sure he will pull it through on the TFSI.
Nope, not really.. I just believe that Revo are the best option out there.. There just isn't many people world wide running the Revo file that GillM is looking at, so as I have had it on two of my cars, I thought it would be of help me commenting..
I run the same stage 4 file as everyone else out there, which is designed around a 3071R on a .63 exhaust housing running an ATP manifold.. Im running a 3076 with a larger exhaust housing and a tubular manifold, so the map is not custom tuned at all but runs fantastically..
I know your intentions are good, but I believe that personal experience counts for a lot more..
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My tuppence worth is that if Revo are able to provide something, then go with them. They are in the UK and have second-to-none customer support in my experience.
Regardless of how good an APR solution is or isn't, I think you'd be stuck with long trips to Awesome in Manchester. Custard Code (loving that name!) isn't really a wise option - I've been hearing too many negative stories, but of course I stand to be corrected as I don't have direct experience of them.
I know Ray West - He's an ace track driver and can build a race car from scratch - Extremely capable but a small operation and always incredibly busy.
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Nope, not really.. I just believe that Revo are the best option out there.. There just isn't many people world wide running the Revo file that GillM is looking at, so as I have had it on two of my cars, I thought it would be of help me commenting..
I run the same stage 4 file as everyone else out there, which is designed around a 3071R on a .63 exhaust housing running an ATP manifold.. Im running a 3076 with a larger exhaust housing and a tubular manifold, so the map is not custom tuned at all but runs fantastically..
I know your intentions are good, but I believe that personal experience counts for a lot more..
Jonny
Although i have zero experience with the REVO stage 4 i do have some experience with the APR stage III
my only point is , that the tune should fit the car.
you wouldn't run a k04 tune on a k03 car and detune it usign a MBC would you ?
so why run a gt3071 tune on an 2871 ?
it would work , but i guess it would be far off from getting the most out of this turbo.
i think the best option for GILIM would be (if APR would agree) is to get the apr stage III software.
he will have to change to APR injectors and intake (due to the 4" MAF) but would get a perfect tune for his car.
if he does go with revo , i would be real interested to see the numbers they pull out of this kit with the 3071 software.
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so far its a toss up between west tuning and revo . cost wise there is about 100 quid between then when you add a boost controller to the revo side of things .
i know rays work very well and seen great "safe" maps producing great power
and i have had revo for a few years now and had no problems at all with it and i like the extra features with it . but seeing as there are more GT28 kits coming out vf and dibilas already have a kit and i have heard that others are coming out soon . it seems strange that revo dont want to get in on the 28 maps .
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VF kit is horrible (not the one you have)
there is a huge thread on it on golfmkv and no one is getting power with that kit.
as far as i understand you have a gt2871 with an a/r of 0.86 which is really a good piece of kit.
they than changed to 0.63 A/R in order to diffrentiate it from their RSR kit and they got very low power figures.
REVO is going with 3071 because they believe it is the ideal turbo for this engine , APR went with 2871 with a 0.86 A/R because they believe it can make around the same power with faster spool . ATP will sell you whatever you want but will supply no tune.
West tuning i don't know ... i am not from the UK
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my only point is , that the tune should fit the car.
you wouldn't run a k04 tune on a k03 car and detune it usign a MBC would you ?
so why run a gt3071 tune on an 2871 ?
it would work , but i guess it would be far off from getting the most out of this turbo.
i see where you are coming from, that makes sense to me.
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Think its probably best that I just leave it now..
Hope that you get the map sorted either way and wish you the best of luck! Make sure that you keep us updated once the kit is on etc..
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no need to stop replying, if people dont like your replies they can hit the ignore button. I think your experiences help a lot on here. you normally one of the fist guys to do half the crazy sh!t that can be done to our cars
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Think its probably best that I just leave it now..
Hope that you get the map sorted either way and wish you the best of luck! Make sure that you keep us updated once the kit is on etc..
just to be clear on that :
i think you are doing amazing thing to your car and the whole gti community (o.k Leon community in my case) can learn from that.
and although i have many things now in work for my car, i will not go as extreme as you and i envy your courage and time investment in this project.
however , we do not have to agree on everything , that's what forums are for.
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however , we do not have to agree on everything , that's what forums are for.
Completely understand, and im not trying to be funny at all.. I think we have both said what we think in terms of what map etc etc.. :smiley:
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^^^^
Nice one! A great example of mutual respect.
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all help is great guys . the more the better to help me weigh things up .
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Martin,
You spoken to Bill about it? Maybe he can come up with something?
If all else fails...you can always run a GIAC file from Regal!
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yeh spoke to bill but he is not clued up with tfsi . and not wanting giac mate
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gilim ,
i reccomend you to read the following threads :
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108776
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109093
those are threads i started when i was interested in this turbo kit.
my conclusion was in the end that if i go with this kit i would either do a custom tune through Unitronic or Beg APR to release me their software (will require injectors / Intake Change).
your conclusions might be different.
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Wouldn't think you would have to beg APR as they will supply you a map if you have pieced together your own K04 upgrade package.
Read towards the bottom of the page.
http://www.goapreu.com/products/turbo_trans20t_k04.htm
"For users who have pieced the kit together on their own, software is now available separately from the kit. The software requires the OEM S3 K04 Turbocharger, OEM S3 Injectors, APR High Pressure Fuel Pump and Full APR Exhaust. Customers with existing 2.0T APR software may purchase software at a discounted price."
I know its a different turbo, but if they will do it for one, they should do it for others.
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gilim ,
i reccomend you to read the following threads :
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108776
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109093
those are threads i started when i was interested in this turbo kit.
my conclusion was in the end that if i go with this kit i would either do a custom tune through Unitronic or Beg APR to release me their software (will require injectors / Intake Change).
your conclusions might be different.
great read seem people are less then happy with giac , which i had heard before .
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Wouldn't think you would have to beg APR as they will supply you a map if you have pieced together your own K04 upgrade package.
Read towards the bottom of the page.
http://www.goapreu.com/products/turbo_trans20t_k04.htm
"For users who have pieced the kit together on their own, software is now available separately from the kit. The software requires the OEM S3 K04 Turbocharger, OEM S3 Injectors, APR High Pressure Fuel Pump and Full APR Exhaust. Customers with existing 2.0T APR software may purchase software at a discounted price."
I know its a different turbo, but if they will do it for one, they should do it for others.
doesn't work that way.
they sell their k04 software but they don't sell their stage iii software
you also need their injectors and intake in order for their software to work.
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gilim ,
i reccomend you to read the following threads :
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108776
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109093
those are threads i started when i was interested in this turbo kit.
my conclusion was in the end that if i go with this kit i would either do a custom tune through Unitronic or Beg APR to release me their software (will require injectors / Intake Change).
your conclusions might be different.
great read seem people are less then happy with giac , which i had heard before .
Not blowing smoke up Jonny's arse, but his K04 wiped the floor with their all singing-all dancing BT car at Inters this year on the 1/4 mile. I know that's no definitive proof of power/capability etc etc.... but it seems a lot of money to go no faster.
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gilim ,
i reccomend you to read the following threads :
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108776
http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=109093
those are threads i started when i was interested in this turbo kit.
my conclusion was in the end that if i go with this kit i would either do a custom tune through Unitronic or Beg APR to release me their software (will require injectors / Intake Change).
your conclusions might be different.
great read seem people are less then happy with giac , which i had heard before .
Not blowing smoke up Jonny's arse, but his K04 wiped the floor with their all singing-all dancing BT car at Inters this year on the 1/4 mile. I know that's no definitive proof of power/capability etc etc.... but it seems a lot of money to go no faster.
Think its more to do with power to weight. Which in its self proves a point.