MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: GTIjames on August 03, 2010, 10:51:08 am
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Well my car is been put back to standard with jkm at the moment and they discovered this when looking at the turbo..
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not too good and not sure on how much longer it could last like that, so its been replaced as I dont want the engine eating it and it costing more :sick:
couldnt tell anything was up myself but i use to get a jingling sound on spool up when the car was cold, once warmed up it stopped, boost was still cracking 28psi and holding at 25psi despite the damaged turbines
anyhow not 100% sure on the cause but it will be looked at further but just a few photo's of caution to those maxing out their k04s
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i take it the bolts loose as it looks like its been hitting the sides :surprised: but good on them for spotting it :notworthy:
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what software are you running, 28psi is a lot, I'm sure on stg2+ mine is max out at 22-23psi
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what software are you running, 28psi is a lot, I'm sure on stg2+ mine is max out at 22-23psi
was just thinking the same :confused:
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Ouch that looks expensive!!
It's difficult from the pictures to ascertain if the tips have been hitting the casing or if it has been caused by stressing of the blades.
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what software are you running, 28psi is a lot, I'm sure on stg2+ mine is max out at 22-23psi
I see something shiny on the outside :innocent:
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what software are you running, 28psi is a lot, I'm sure on stg2+ mine is max out at 22-23psi
thats boost gauge figures so might be slightly out, not been logged since i had it back from my accident as lost interest..
but running stage 2 + but with a forge actuator which i think might be the culprit as it increased the boost, i was running b7t5f8
turbo is just over 40k miles and been mapped for about 30k miles part bluefin and past year recently revo stage 2+
not going to blame software etc, i like to use the boost and have had 40k miles using it pretty much constantly :laugh: been great fun :drinking:
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Yes, an uprated actuator, but doesn't the software still need to request the max boost?
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who set the bluefin up for u ? as it looks like its been like that for some time :scared: and was the bluefin setup for the uprated actuator ?
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I've logged mine with the Forge actuator and had over 27psi on VCDS logs. This was due to overboosting with the actuator rod set incorrectly on the wastegate and the car was only requesting 25.5psi. Once it was set correctly it still slightly overboosted at 26psi, but it was within 0.5psi and so was regarded as being within operating parameters. Maybe your actuator was set a little too tight to the flap opening and wasn't getting the flow right. Not the reason for the blade damage though, just the overboost. :happy2:
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who set the bluefin up for u ?
You can't setup Bluefin and I believe James changed to Revo last year sometime. :smiley:
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but would the overboosting make the blades get even hotter and the weak point are the tips as they are so thin hence why they have just come off
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who set the bluefin up for u ?
You can't setup Bluefin and I believe James changed to Revo last year sometime. :smiley:
i thought superchips could set it up for u for the mods u have as i am sure nath had his changed a few times :confused:
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who set the bluefin up for u ?
You can't setup Bluefin and I believe James changed to Revo last year sometime. :smiley:
i thought superchips could set it up for u for the mods u have as i am sure nath had his changed a few times :confused:
Not in the scheme of things like you can on Revo. I had maps changed but they were just tweaks. I think the most boost they run is about 21-22 PSI even on stage 3.
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it was revo before the forge actuator :happy2:
i thought the actuator was a fitted a bit tight as I was logging and getting overboost when it was first fitted, so i reduced the boost via the sps switch and had plans to get it back in to be looked at but never got time as i was manic at work and then pranged it..
probably my own fault for not sorting it sooner :stupid:
anyhow my next car is not going to have a turbo and no after market mods :signLOL:
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but would the actuator not increase this boost if that was not set up correctly ?
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it was revo before the forge actuator :happy2:
i thought the actuator was a fitted a bit tight as I was logging and getting overboost when it was first fitted, so i reduced the boost via the sps switch and had plans to get it back in to be looked at but never got time as i was manic at work and then pranged it..
probably my own fault for not sorting it sooner :stupid:
anyhow my next car is not going to have a turbo and no after market mods :signLOL:
so the best thing to do if having the actuator fitted is get it set up correctly with plenty of logging done :smiley:
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Yeah definitely not a simple bolt on mod like a exhaust or intake this requires some testing and logging to be set up properly.
Not 100% sure if this is the cause but looks likely,
I know mine is not the first ko4 to be killed on here so any idea on what caused the others to go and any similar to mine.
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all the ones i know of that had blown turbos had fuel pumps done :confused: infact i think they all ran revo stage 2 + too :confused:
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Mines been running apr fuel pump for 15k miles now and no problems on that side what so ever, cam follower is in good order too
Ps for sale soon, pm if interested
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where would ythose shards of metal be then?? stuick up against the IC core or exiting via the exhaust. not to sure which turbine that is
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Looks like the hotside to me... exhaust.
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Those shards of metal will be rattling around inside the cat somewhere.
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Have JKM commented on whether they think the turbo was running too hot? I am no expert but from the picks it looks to me like it might have been?
Running too hot could be caused by a couple of things - running too lean or running too much boost.
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EGT'S were too high in all probability, have seen this on a few occasions with very similar damage as a result.
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I thought the fuel setting was a bit lean for running a pump :smiley:
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would have thought 28psi is taking you well into uncharted EGT territory on a sustained run :surprised:
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It only ever spiked at 28psi then held at 24/25psi
Jkm suspected egts as a cause but will investigate further, although since I have had the car back from accident repairs it has not had an uprated intercooler on, however I have not done that many miles, c2k.
I probably should have dropped the boost back further with the absence of a I/c but you live and learn, let it be a warning for those going stage 2+ to monitor everything to make sure it does not get too hot down there, luckily mine was saved by jkm before any serious damage was done to the engine or any other parts :happy2:
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since you need a new k04, you should get one and hybridize it :party: :party:
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Guys I have just seen this thread that our customer put up. This fault may have been caused by a number of issues, EGT is one of them and this is what we thought on first seeing the turbo - however to be totally confident of the cause it would need to be properly analysed by an actual turbo specialist such as a company who build them and have substantial real knowledge of failure modes.
EGT’s can be raised as a result of to much boost / running a lean AFR or even excessively retarded timing (as per Turbo Anti Lag systems!!). Taking one example from these listed - Lean running can be due to lots and lots of reasons on the TFSI engine and would need proper investigation on its own to pin point anything (even if this was the reason for the fault).
A brand new turbo has now been fitted to the customers car and the old unit has to be returned as a core unit, As the car is in our workshop to be returned to factory stock and looking at how much stuff has been taken off - the fault (if it were a hardware issue) could easily get taken off during this process, the car is still in the workshop now having parts removed!!
We will certainly be checking the car over substantially before it leaves as this failure was only seen once work had got underway on it.
Something that is possibly related and you can see from the image I have attached below - is that this turbo is also leaking exhaust gases from the centre v-band clamp on the turbo housing itself. We have not seen this happen before on any TFSI turbo in our workshop either. Exhaust soot can be seen over a section of the turbo compressor housing.
We do know the rather unfortunate history of this car, and it did get a bit of a large shock load to the exhaust system not to long ago.
There is the possibility that the two events are actually related – large knock to the exhaust transferring a large axial load onto the turbo housing. If the turbo wheel was still spinning at the point of the large load (which I think it would have been) then turbo wheel damage ‘could’ have resulted, it could have been only one section/blade that took an unusual loading and then failed - that would lead to a foreign object being spun around causing more damage. It is just a wild theory but keeping in mind the shock load on the exhaust that would have been transferred we wouldn’t want to rule it out.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jkm.org.uk%2Fbanner%2Fturbo1.jpg&hash=642f3b789f73227788c2bd5746b85317fbd6119b)
For the record JKM haven’t actually seen the need to use the Forge actuator from the testing that we have done, however we acknowledge that that nature of tuning cars will mean that customers will always like to try new products as they come to marketplace. I have not seen any logs from the car running on this actuator myself so I am sorry that I can’t comment further on how much the boost had been over spiking etc.
Above are some of the possibilities of what ‘may’ or may not have caused this failure. Please also note that JKM did not install/configure this cars Stage 2+ code before anyone asks.
One of our workshop Technicians spotted this the moment the turbo was off. The turbo shaft assembly would have been seriously out of balance and may have failed catastrophically if left!
I hope this helps with some extra input. Hopefully its not to confusing for you, my head hurts anyway!
Once the car is back to stock I will be giving it a good road test to see if anything looks wrong.
Keith
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thanks for that keith, the recent accident had also crossed my mind in been a contributing factor and i had asked them to check this over but you can never be certain...
but i must reiterate what i have said earlier in this post in thanking you for spotting the fault and for your continued help :happy2:
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James, that soot isnt from your old downpipe was it?, that was cracked around the exhaust flange, that jim actually spotted when i took it for fitting to my car if you recall?
Could this be linked??
Miltek then welded it, Sent it back and Jkm Installed it with no issues.
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all good info , thanks Keith / James for sharing :happy2:
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all good info , thanks Keith / James for sharing :happy2:
:happy2: +1