MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: gadge on June 12, 2009, 10:12:45 pm
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I would of though there would be only one winner here, the petrol. Just curious if the derv is a decent contender?
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petrol - ED 30
diesel - GT170 :happy2:
good luck :driver:
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Technically there isn't a GTI diesel :innocent:
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As much as diesel technology has come on leaps and bounds over the last few years you can't beat revving the nuts out of a petrol engine!
Plus petrol is cheaper and is smoother and quieter! :happy2:
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Technically there isn't a GTI diesel :innocent:
....Isn't the Mk6 GTD one?
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blogcdn.com%2Fwww.autoblog.com%2Fmedia%2F2009%2F04%2Fvw_golf_gtd_580.jpg&hash=d0831cbb6c728ab472f13cb7db47913f3608175a)
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^^^ Still not a GTI :P
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GTD :evilgrin:
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^^^^
But a bit too close for comfort, don't you think?
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^^^^
But a bit too close for comfort, don't you think?
VW have done a GTD in the past but it'll never be a GTI! :evilgrin:
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speaking as a diesel owner on a GTi forum .... petrol all the time !
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Has anyone tried the new common rail TDI?
I have huge respect for diesels, I used to be a PD nut, but the 2.0 PD was pants in comparison to the 1.9 so I went TFSI.
I still miss the torque!
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25th Anni was the only one which wore the GTI badge well.
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Has anyone tried the new common rail TDI?
I have huge respect for diesels, I used to be a PD nut, but the 2.0 PD was pants in comparison to the 1.9 so I went TFSI.
I still miss the torque!
Yep driven it in the MK6, Tiguan and Passat and it is superb! Very smooth and sounds much better than the outgoing engine! :happy2:
Still not as good as a petrol! :laugh:
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Friend of mine's got a GTI diesel - granted, a mk4, but it goes like stink. VERY capable car with GTI handling.
Really rate it :smiley:
We also tested the GT170 - and LOVED it. The 140 didn't drive as well. (imho)
Dan
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I tried the gt170. Could not stop the wheelspin! :signLOL: so much torque!
It's was a new (ish) one of them or my gti 15 months old at the time, think I made the right decision cos if I had gone gt170 every time a gti swept past me I would have questioned my purchase. :innocent:
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when i bouught my gt tdi i was doing a lot of miles each day-being a Yorkshire man who don't lke spending :signLOL:i got the diesel plus the gti wasn't realised then--but now i work a mile from home i would get a petrol gti
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(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi20.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb242%2Fmagzm8%2Fgolfs.jpg&hash=445e200751b2befb33c572177e88db0226eb5ff8)
I stupidly convinced myself that the R was costing too much to run. :sad1:
The Blue car lasted me just 7 months, bet you can guess how it was fuelled. :rolleye:
The red one was a return to sanity :happy2: This was all within 20 months. :surprised:
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Well i have the 170 diesel and i think its a great car its got plenty of go and is mm off a normal gti and defo has the same great chassis!!!
Petrol might be cheaper but if u do the maths to the miles u get out of the derv it still wins!
And personally the only thing missing is the noise :driver:
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You need to do about 20K miles for a diesel to be financially viable. They cost more to buy and diesel is more expensive.
A golf 170bhp from new priced at £23,000 compared to a GTI priced at list of £19,995
Volkswagen Golf Hatchback
2.0 TDi (170bhp) GTD 3d DSG
List price £23,160
Fuel consumption 50 mpg
Price per litre 104.5p
Extra cost to buy £3,165
Saving per 1000 miles £15.61
Miles to break even 202,781
Time to break even
at 12,000 miles per year 17 years
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Where did you get those figures from? The GTI 3 door may have cost 20k back in 2004 but not anymore!
Keep in mind also that the Diesels will often fetch slightly better prices when you sell them on again which will offset some of the costs, but the GTD is actually slightly cheaper than the GTI IIRC. Just have a look at the Leon FR TFSI vs TDI 170 which is directly comparable to the GTI/GTD. The Leon FR TDI sells in massively higher numbers and its resale is much better too.
If buying a mk5 Golf (this is the mk5 forum after all) then I'd say go with the GTI as the GT spec isn't as good even though the performance of the 170 TDI ain't far off the 200PS GTI.
If looking at a mk5.5 then my money would be going on the Diseasel. Probably anyway.
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Thats a comparison of new prices (diesels are always more expensive new)
Here you go
http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/petrol-vs-diesel/
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Funnily enough I replied to that Parkers report and they moderated it off!!! All I said was that every time I see one of these reports they fail to mention the better re-sale of the Diesel which brings back some of the initial outlay and that I thought better of Parkers being as they are supposedly in the business of used car prices. Ah well :innocent:
My personal point of view is that horses for courses and you don't always buy Diesels for their better fuel consumption as very often the turbo Diesels offer the best performance vs economy model of a given range. On a car enthusiasts forum the pendulum is bound to swing towards performance petrols but 99% of the population don't exactly give a monkeys about their car's performance per se, their car is like a white goods product - they want reliability and value for money, in whatever order suits them.
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They lose as much money as the petrol, they just go for a bit more, but the diesel cost more in the first place.
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As much as diesel technology has come on leaps and bounds over the last few years you can't beat revving the nuts out of a petrol engine!
Plus petrol is cheaper and is smoother and quieter! :happy2:
...........went to Esso today & it cost me £1.10 a litre for there super unleaded !!!!!!!!! :scared: :sad:
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Yeah but ESSO = Fail
I use V-Power and can get it for £1.05
Although i work in Kensington which has the highest petrol price in the country - £1.49 :signLOL:
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You need to do about 20K miles for a diesel to be financially viable. They cost more to buy and diesel is more expensive.
A golf 170bhp from new priced at £23,000 compared to a GTI priced at list of £19,995
Volkswagen Golf Hatchback
2.0 TDi (170bhp) GTD 3d DSG
List price £23,160
Fuel consumption 50 mpg
Price per litre 104.5p
Extra cost to buy £3,165
Saving per 1000 miles £15.61
Miles to break even 202,781
Time to break even
at 12,000 miles per year 17 years
Forgot to mention tax and insurance, both less for diesel.
I love how some people (not anyone in particular) find it difficult to appreciate the fuels in their own rights, diesel will never offer the same driving experience as a petrol, but it does have a lot to offer.
I like Rock music and Classical, but I don't find it necessary to slag one of whenever there is an opportunity.
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Diesel is an awful dirty fuel which will be eventually banned. Cant stand them. Try living in london with the amount of diesels going around, makes me feel sick being around built up roads :sick:
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Dont forget that most people run their cars on 99/98 RON so that is not cheaper than Diesel, round my area anyway.
Still cant beat the sound of the GTI to the derv. It also comes down to how many miles you will be doing in it?
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As some of you may know I sold my ED30 for an A3 S-Line derv at the start of the year, mainly because the ED30 was costing a lot to run. I was putting roughly £80 in the ED30 every week, when I got the A3 I was expecting to save a lot of money but I didn't, about £10 a week roughly! I know that is £520 every year but it wasn't worth selling the ED30 over. Unless your doing galactic miles, I mean over 600 a week I don't think a diesel saves a great deal of money :happy2:
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Methanol.
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I am looking at a Mk5 at the moment and looking at Diesels for the wife. I suppose the difference is that with a diesel, you do not have to drive the car hard to get the enjoyment, whereas with the petrol, to get maximum enjoyment, you need to get the engine spinning up above 4k into the fun zone.
Money no object, petrol everytime, however needs neccesitate :sad1:
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I am looking at a Mk5 at the moment and looking at Diesels for the wife. I suppose the difference is that with a diesel, you do not have to drive the car hard to get the enjoyment, whereas with the petrol, to get maximum enjoyment, you need to get the engine spinning up above 4k into the fun zone.
I don't think that's strictly true, certainly not with the 2.0 TFSI. There is power all over the rev range, so it still pulls well from 2000 rpm in 4th. It's nothing like a V-TEC.
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I would go for a petrol any day just cos I hate the noise diesels make but each to their own
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When I purchased my soot chucker back in 2005, it was an ex dealer demo car and thus pretty much fully loaded. They wanted £1800 more than a similar petrol model (albeit with poorer spec) and £3K less than then cheapest MK5 GTi they had (although to be fair the GTI hadn't been out long).
I knocked them down and eventally got it for only £350 more than the petrol model (thus £4.5k cheaper than a GTI). Whilst I would be the first to agree with most of what everyone has said about a petrol being a "nicer" drivers car for spirited driving, TBH, round my way a t least, rush hour traffic is so dense, that 0-60 times actually mean nothing. The beauty of the derv is that it just pulls and pulls in any gear, meaning it's a much more relaxed drive than revving the nuts off a petrol just to be first to the traffic lights.
Also over the last nearly 5 years of ownership, it' snever dipped below about 47mpg, whilst regularly seeing mid fifties. So my extra £350 over a petrol was deffo money well spent.
As with everying thing, there will always be plusses and minuses with any car, but I really believe whether you choose a GTI, a Derv or a Lesser Petrol engined model, the MK5 platform was so good, that you are pretty much guaranteed a decent ride.
Now if motoring costs were not a factor (aka I win the lottery), then yes, I would probably be driving a GTI or better still an R32 or New Golf R, or Aston Martin or Ferrari or..........
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I don't think that's strictly true, certainly not with the 2.0 TFSI. There is power all over the rev range, so it still pulls well from 2000 rpm in 4th. It's nothing like a V-TEC.
I had the TFSI Cupra back in June 2007 for a few years and know what you mean about the power being available. I suppose it refers to the above where the driver is not one who is wanting to get to spool rpm and pull all power asap and drive with spirit. If it was me, I would defo go back to a TFSI lump, however since it is the wife, she is much less inclined to knock it down a gear (despite numerous attempts to teach her the technique) if she wants to pick up a bit of speed.
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I would go for a petrol any day just cos I hate the noise diesels make but each to their own
....Me too. I know it's irrational and diesels have some advantages (only economy methinks) but I think the sound any vehicle makes is a major part of driving pleasure.
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Depends on the diesel. My old 330cd sounded great as it was 6 cylinder and was quicker when mapped than the petrol equivalent. It also still returned better mpg.
I have also owned an A3 TDI 170 S-Line Quattro which was awful in my opinion. I hated the engine and the economy was terrible (probably down to the 4x4 mind).
As others have said, the difference in savings in a diesel make it a good buy only if you do mega miles. I drive about 800 miles per week, but choose to do it in the GTI. I can still get 34mpg and the drive is so much more fun than in a diesel.
At the end of the day, you should just get the one you prefer the drive of and forget about the small savings (if any). I think in a VW, the petrol engines are far nicer than the diesels, however in BMW 6 cylinder, I actually prefer the derv sometimes as the torque is immense. Remap a 330d and it's as fast as the 330i. The bottom line then becomes do you prefer an engine that revs or one that has low down torque?
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My 2p
December 2009 i bought this 2.0tdi gt-sport
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww172%2Fbeny_C%2FSAM_0277.jpg&hash=30210d93fb71daa7066ea860086c41ab9cf2267e)
March 2010 I changed it for this
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww172%2Fbeny_C%2F2-1.jpg&hash=b3809a905bfb69db11e3a55ebb25a33918b31e3b)
If your not doing the milage buy the GTi!!!! As much of a good car the diesel is, it just cannot be compared to a GTi :happy2:
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I have a GTI and my mum has the TDI but i much prefer my GTI, its in a different league!! :wink:
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Diesel is the fuel of the devil. Eat it at the cost of your soul.
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Diesel is the fuel of the devil. Eat it at the cost of your soul.
....cmdrfire should know.. He pisses excellence yet again! :notworthy:
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Diesel is the fuel of the devil. Eat it at the cost of your soul.
mine must be black :evilgrin:
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I previously owned a Mk5 170 GT DSG before my MK6 GTI (as sig below). The GT was a great car and would give most things a run for its money. It was brilliant on motorways, had great torque and the mpg was fantastic. The weekly millage I used to get out of my GT was around 450 miles and with the GTI I get around 350 miles on a full tank. The Mk5 GT always looks a bit plain though compared to the GTI’s especially with standard wheels. To me the Mk5 GT isn’t a patch on the Mk5 GTI. However in all fairness I think the new Mk6 GTD has come on leaps and bounds and compares favourably well in all departments to the GTI. So I probably wouldn’t rule out every buying a diesel again.
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Drinking from the dirty pump i used to call it!
Had this for about 2 years - 170 tdi.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm5.static.flickr.com%2F4026%2F4701684472_9cf080afaa_b_d.jpg&hash=92bf0129afd9fca58549bd5f6a88aac5bff76d3f)
Tramped and banged like feck esp in the wet. Eventually got frustrated by the lack of rev range and piss poor economy 35-40 mpg i was averaging on my commute. Same commute in the Ed30 i can get between 33 - 37 mpg. Very noisy engine also. Handled pretty sweetly tho and the brakes were better than the eddy. Kept its value well also - only lost 3k in two years.
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^^^^
I really like the looks of the Leons/Cupras - Much better looking IMO than any of the Skoda's [sorry to the Skoda owners here - It's only one opinion].
I seriously thought about it and, in fact, even ordered a DSG 2.0 Mk5 Golf TDI but changed my order to the GTI when I woke up the following morning! I knew that every time I saw a Mk5 GTI my heart would sink with longing and regret.
Diseasal might be a sensible option but it'll never be for me - I'm simply not a Captain Sensible. My driving style doesn't need to rely on torque - I use the gears. And also, sound is so important - I don't care how 'good' the BMW diesels are.
I don't know why and I do know it's completely irrational, but I find a GTD version (Mk6) of the GTI to be an imposter... Sacrilege. Yes, I realise it's a good car.
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The BMW 335d is supposed to be good. How does a stage2+ ED30 KO4 compared to a mapped 335d? Will the ED30 keep up in performance?
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Thing with a 335d is that it's a diesel. Therefore it is rubbish.
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Thing with a 335d is that it's a diesel. Therefore it is rubbish.
You clearly haven't driven one then! They're stunning cars to drive and once remapped they're VERY, VERY fast. You'd hardly even notice they're a diesel they're so refined. I would have had one in a heartbeat, but the wife won't drive an auto (you can't get them in manual) hence I bought a 330i instead.
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It's still a diesel... and I would know...
Compression ignition ftl. Give me a clean burning spark any day of the week.
/zealot
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Thing with a 335d is that it's a diesel. Therefore it is rubbish.
You clearly haven't driven one then! They're stunning cars to drive and once remapped they're VERY, VERY fast. You'd hardly even notice they're a diesel they're so refined. I would have had one in a heartbeat, but the wife won't drive an auto (you can't get them in manual) hence I bought a 330i instead.
I have - 335cd. Auto box was crap - over revved in sport and held the gears too long . Also still has the problem of a limited powerband which is why i sold my diesel and bought the gti.