Rolling Road RESULTS @ JKM - Oct 16th 2010....

[Hedge]

^^^^
I noticed that Jim was very definite about running in 4th gear when asked on Saturday.

Yes but if your car produces a billion horsepower it will do that in all gears, it is just easier to measure if you use a higher one.
Ideally you would use 6th as that gives you the greatest granularity, but completely pointless.

[Thor]

^^^^
I noticed that Jim was very definite about running in 4th gear when asked on Saturday.

Yes but if your car produces a billion horsepower it will do that in all gears, it is just easier to measure if you use a higher one.
Ideally you would use 6th as that gives you the greatest granularity, but completely pointless.

Crickey Hedge, you had a dictionary for breakfast.

[muckipup]

I think a trip to motorscopes rolling road  pays dividends, at least you can walk away with a smile on your face  

....If your point is that going on JKM's DD rollers doesn't pay dividends and you don't walk away smiling, you ought to think again. As has been said countless times and is appreciated by most drivers, it's all about driveability and the plotted curves - Not all about willy waving the highest bhp numbers. It's all relative and a rolling-road session is an opportunity to health-check your car. Several folks were very glad that JKM were able to identify and solve minor problems on their cars and will have driven away smiling.

Thanks to you and JKM for organising a great day, Robin  .  Here is the plot from my Octavia VRS running a 'developmental' map which should be equivalent to a Stage 2+





Will post up on Sy's sticky thread too.

Dave

[Saint Steve]

^^^^
I noticed that Jim was very definite about running in 4th gear when asked on Saturday.

Yes but if your car produces a billion horsepower it will do that in all gears, it is just easier to measure if you use a higher one.
Ideally you would use 6th as that gives you the greatest granularity, but completely pointless.

Where that in the Dico?

[Hedge]

For those that didn't go to school http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granularity  

[Sunglasses Ron]

Run 1: 263bhp@6500rpm, 265lb/ft@3600rpm..........B1T6F9
Run 2: 275bhp@6500rpm, 275lb/ft@3900rpm..........B5T6F9

Did the first run and wondered why it wasn't anywhere near 280bhp. JKM said it was a healthy looking graph and the car ran fine but the boost settings would need to be altered. I thought I'd left them at whatever Revo had loaded them as at GTI International.Turns out the settings were at B1T6F9. With the help of T_T, we adjusted them to B5T6F9 (I couldn't recall the precise settings) and ran the second time. After a few goes, it reached 275bhp. After having a chat with a few guys, I will readjust the settings to B7T5F9 and see what happens.


EDIT: I've had a look at the settings on my SPS switch. Default is B6T2F9, A is B1T6F9, B is B6T6F9, C is B7T6F9. Not sure how the default was set at that, but B6T6F9 is what's written in the booklet by the Revo guys.

You could of probably squeezed another few bhp out of her on a higher boost setting mate (7, 8 or even 9). Good figures though  Is this a Stage 2 GTI I take it?



*EDIT* Just read on other thread that yours is a Stage 1 Ed30 I'm sorry, but what is it with JKM's rollers and mapped cars? As Chungsters .:R was making about the same as a Stage 1 Ed30 with the same engine!!! How is this at all possible? If it is, then there are an awful lot of people on this forum waving there willys in the air after thinking their gain of 5bhp on their cars from a Stage 1 map is out of this world 
Are they all wrong?

Glad I couldn't make it now TBH, as I would of only left there, having driven all that way, p*ssed off after probably being told me car was less than 300 bhp.. 

Rant over..

Quick question, what gear should you think rolling road power runs should be taken Ben?

and Lee, whats the manufacturers stated bhp and torque figures for you Stock R out of interest? comparing it to jkm's rollers?

Every RR i've been on has been run in 4th from what I have seen. Yes JKM's stock car results are bang on Steve, but that wasn't my point. I said that they don't seem to like mapped cars!!! Unless of course a 5 bhp increase on a mapped KO4 is about right?

What happened to your map anyway Steve?  How has that happened?

[Sunglasses Ron]

I think a trip to motorscopes rolling road  pays dividends, at least you can walk away with a smile on your face  

....If your point is that going on JKM's DD rollers doesn't pay dividends and you don't walk away smiling, you ought to think again. As has been said countless times and is appreciated by most drivers, it's all about driveability and the plotted curves - Not all about willy waving the highest bhp numbers. It's all relative and a rolling-road session is an opportunity to health-check your car. Several folks were very glad that JKM were able to identify and solve minor problems on their cars and will have driven away smiling.

Totally agree Robin, and I would much rather have a lower accurate reading from a RR than a willy waving one. But it doesn't get away from the fact that according to JKM's figures a S3/Cupra R/Golf R or Rocco R will only make gains of aabout 5 bhp?!?!  If this is right, then there are an awful lot of disillusioned people out there that have been ripped off!

Also (and i'm not pointing fingers here) but i've never seen so many cars suffer from problems (that JKM can sort) when attending a RR day there? 

[Janner_Sy]

I think a trip to motorscopes rolling road  pays dividends, at least you can walk away with a smile on your face 

why do they give away free horsepower in doggy bags do they???  someone on here with a cupra, left a previous RR day(Think it was surreys DD rollers) and went straight to another set of rollers to get new figures which were nearer to his willy waiving claims

if your car makes good figures on a DD roller, you know that your car is running well.  as it happens every DD roller that i have been on makes pretty much identical figures to what i make on JKMs

[Janner_Sy]

I think a trip to motorscopes rolling road  pays dividends, at least you can walk away with a smile on your face  

....If your point is that going on JKM's DD rollers doesn't pay dividends and you don't walk away smiling, you ought to think again. As has been said countless times and is appreciated by most drivers, it's all about driveability and the plotted curves - Not all about willy waving the highest bhp numbers. It's all relative and a rolling-road session is an opportunity to health-check your car. Several folks were very glad that JKM were able to identify and solve minor problems on their cars and will have driven away smiling.

Totally agree Robin, and I would much rather have a lower accurate reading from a RR than a willy waving one. But it doesn't get away from the fact that according to JKM's figures a S3/Cupra R/Golf R or Rocco R will only make gains of aabout 5 bhp?!?!  If this is right, then there are an awful lot of disillusioned people out there that have been ripped off!

Also (and i'm not pointing fingers here) but i've never seen so many cars suffer from problems (that JKM can sort) when attending a RR day there? 

5Hp peak though, there will be bigger gains at points across the RPM range as well as an increase in torque across the entire curve.  me personally i think it would be a waste of time to stage 1 an S3/cupra R.  unless you do it with an intake/fuel pump or go dtraight to stage 2

[vRStu]

Glad I couldn't make it now TBH, as I would of only left there, having driven all that way, p*ssed off after probably being told me car was less than 300 bhp..  

Rant over..

It seems quite a simple concept to me, if you put a stock car on there and it makes stock figures then you put a mapped car on and it makes xyz figures then that's what that car is doing on the day.

Some of the cars that had less then 'expected' figures had problems which were discussed with the owners at the time.  Notably Theo's car was very smokey and there was a suggestion of investigating injectors.  Mukipup's car appears to have a less than ideal map, look at the AFR. Theo had his REVO settings at the wrong level.  Steve Saint has issues with his Bluefin.

Which was the car that made 5hp over stock on Stage 1??  I might have missed that one.  

You've been around long enough to know the score here and have argued the point many times before.    

[vRStu]

me personally i think it would be a waste of time to stage 1 an S3/cupra R.  unless you do it with an intake/fuel pump or go dtraight to stage 2

I know someone that had an 8P S3 with Stage 1 Software, Panel Filter and Milltek Downpipe that made circa 330hp and strong torque on the rollers at Surrey Rolling Road.  Wouldn't call that pointless.

[heavyd]

was only joking mate
Thought I would get a couple of bites with that one
I totally agree, its a dyno lottery anyway. At least you get an idea if your car is running properly etc. My last car was dynod on DD rollers, and found that it wasnt running right, and I sorted the problem, so it was a good fault finding tool.
The good old saying that they are designed more for setting up and live mapping cars, than they are for a precise measuring tool can also be said.
Just like the motorscope day when the rs focus bloke found out he paid £2500 for a mountune tuning package, that actually produced 20 bhp less than a standard RS focus with a panel filter on the same day etc etc

[markc]

I think a trip to motorscopes rolling road  pays dividends, at least you can walk away with a smile on your face 

why do they give away free horsepower in doggy bags do they???  someone on here with a cupra, left a previous RR day(Think it was surreys DD rollers) and went straight to another set of rollers to get new figures which were nearer to his willy waiving claims

if your car makes good figures on a DD roller, you know that your car is running well.  as it happens every DD roller that i have been on makes pretty much identical figures to what i make on JKMs

My Stage 1 ED30 made 296.8bhp on RS Tunings DD's,  so....... should I get the same/very similar figure then at JKM (which I'm 270 miles away from) ?

[vRStu]

My Stage 1 ED30 made 296.8bhp on RS Tunings DD's,  so....... should I get the same/very similar figure then at JKM (which I'm 270 miles away from) ?

You should so long as the variables are the same, the Dyno is operated properly and you use similar fuel.  On the bottom of a DD graph is a set of variables which can be replicated on another dyno.

Not lashing the car down properly is another way to 'vary' the reported output.

[Janner_Sy]

me personally i think it would be a waste of time to stage 1 an S3/cupra R.  unless you do it with an intake/fuel pump or go dtraight to stage 2

I know someone that had an 8P S3 with Stage 1 Software, Panel Filter and Milltek Downpipe that made circa 330hp and strong torque on the rollers at Surrey Rolling Road.  Wouldn't call that pointless.

as said above in the post, i think its pointless unless unless you are running extra hardware